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Forum Index » » * Development Blog * » » Fleet levels and more!
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 Author Fleet levels and more!

Joined: February 06, 2008
Posts: 157
From: Dorset
Posted: 2011-06-16 20:56   
I am liking the proposed changes to the game in thought but would caution players not to criticise soo heavily into a idea. It is like trying to discredit a theory, it doesn't work without evidence and/or practice.

That being said, my two cents on the situation is:

What about those players who have been in this game for a long time and who still have a large amount of credits stored up from previous versions of the game? Don't be shy, you know who you are (I used to be one).

Final word:
To anyone complaining about 'having to pay' for fleets, you won't have to pay for fleets but some individuals like myself will put our hands in our pockets and 'invest' in the future of the fleet. It is exactly the same way that clans operate servers for other games, they work on 'donations' and in return that player is given higher priority or respect in the clan.

Don't think for a second that you will HAVE to pay real money to enjoy the game.

P.S. I bet 1000 credits that [PB] will introduce a "pay to join" policy if/when this change is put into practice.
When the universe collapses and dies there will be 3 survivors; Tyr Anasazi, the cockroaches and Dylan Hunt trying to save the cockroaches...

Chief Marshal
Pitch Black

Joined: March 19, 2002
Posts: 378
Posted: 2011-06-17 22:50   

On 2011-06-16 20:56, Okkam's Razor (Snafu) wrote:

P.S. I bet 1000 credits that [PB] will introduce a "pay to join" policy if/when this change is put into practice.

::gasps:: how did you know!!!!

No matter how hard they have tried. They havnt figured out how to nerf skill yet :P


Joined: June 25, 2010
Posts: 787
From: Dres-Kona
Posted: 2011-06-18 15:24   

On 2011-06-16 18:05, Pantheon wrote:
I'm not sure why people think small fleets will have any less of a chance than large fleets already existing. It costs the same amount.

because more people means more money available for that fleet and the cost of leveling will be distrubited among the people better meaning everyone has to pay less as a whole.

Example say a fleet has 40 members and it costs 40 thousand credits to rank up. Each member only has to pay 1 thousand credits to help out(assuming that everyone will, but will most likely will not happen).
And another fleet has 4 members it will cost each member 10 thousand credits to rank up(again assuming that everyone will, but will most likely will not happen)

So larger fleets will have an easier time than smaller fleets
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Fleet Admiral
Galactic Navy

Joined: March 19, 2005
Posts: 1127
Posted: 2011-06-19 11:01   
Goodness, it's almost like large, successful fleets will tend to have a higher indicator of their size and success than smaller, less successful fleets.
[Darkspace Moderator] [Galactic Navy Fleet Officer]

Faster than Light

Joined: June 20, 2009
Posts: 730
From: sol
Posted: 2011-06-19 11:13   

On 2011-06-19 11:01, Gejaheline wrote:
Goodness, it's almost like large, successful fleets will tend to have a higher indicator of their size and success than smaller, less successful fleets.

Haveing a Large fleet with alot of money/creds dose not really indicate how "Sucessful" a fleet is, but it really depends on your Definition of "Sucessful"

I could go farther into it but Eh...just my two cents.

\"War does not decide who is right, but who is left\"
\"I stopped fighting my inner demons we're on the same side now\"

Pitch Black

Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3821
From: LobsterTown
Posted: 2011-06-19 21:38   

On 2011-06-19 11:01, Gejaheline wrote:
Goodness, it's almost like large, successful fleets will tend to have a higher indicator of their size and success than smaller, less successful fleets.

It's simple economics.

... in space, no one can hear you scream.....

Azure Prower
Chief Marshal

Joined: March 14, 2006
Posts: 308
Posted: 2011-06-19 21:57   
I'm not sure feeding the ego of the larger fleets is the way to breathe new life into this game.

This whole fleet leveling sounds good in theory. But is a bad idea in practice.

There's a reason World of Warcraft lost 600k subscribers and I'm willing to bet the guild leveling alienating people and applying pressure on smaller guilds was one of the reasons.


Marius Falix
Grand Admiral
Sundered Weimeriners

Joined: July 05, 2010
Posts: 268
From: Luyten
Posted: 2011-06-20 07:51   
some people like having smaller fleets with the same options.
it all depends on the actual amount for each upgrade really.
“We give our lives for the lives of Humanity. May you all see better days.”

We are the Falix Brothers...


Joined: February 09, 2010
Posts: 2
Posted: 2011-06-20 13:31   
One idea could be to allow a new build to occur. The new build would give individual ship commander's the use of smaller escorts such as bombers and fighters. The escorts would be built on a planet in the shipyard and would then be stored in the ships cargo hold. Depending upon the class of a ship used would depend upon the type and number of escorts deployed.

Another idea could be to allow factions to build NPC ships in the shipyards as well. The ships that would be built would be the same types that are normally used by the ship commander during regular play. Depending upon the rank of the pilot as well as construction experience would determine the type of ship built and how long the ship would remain on the battlefield.

Another idea would to be allowed to call in reinforcements from an available reinforcement pool for each system. The reinforcement's would be called in to assist the fleet and would reamin until destroyed or ten minutes which ever occured first. A cool down period of five minutes between each reinforcement call would keep pilots from massing hundreds of reinforcements and thus lagging the server out.

A pilot could only call in three ships per reinforcement wave.
A pilot could only call in one Capitol ship per twenty minutes with a cool down time of ten minutes in between each wave.

NPC fleet formation's- I noticed that NPC's ships can be directed against target's. Why not give the pilots the ability to group the NPC present that have not been called in as reinforcements' in a few types of organized attack wings.

Each attack wing formation would provide a certain increase in attack value depending upon the formation used.

Chief Marshal
Galactic Navy

Joined: May 19, 2002
Posts: 2576
Posted: 2011-06-21 06:27   

On 2011-06-19 21:38, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:

On 2011-06-19 11:01, Gejaheline wrote:
Goodness, it's almost like large, successful fleets will tend to have a higher indicator of their size and success than smaller, less successful fleets.

It's simple economics.

Yes however, not everyone wants to work at Walmart, despite the fact that they are the single largest employer of private citizens.

Here's the deal.

Smaller fleets have the same opportunity as larger ones, yes.

However, larger ones due to having anywhere from two to three times more active members, can much more easily reach whatever levels they want.

Now this is of course, expected. This also causes a bit of a trend where people will join a fleet just for the rewards, and not for the whole point of being in a fleet (like I dunno, you actually like their goals, motivations, the people, etc.). Which is entirely up to them, but it means smaller fleets die off fast, and the ones that do stick around get to work many times harder to reach the same level.

And at that point there can be so much invested in a fleet that if it dies off well.. there went all those credits. Great for an overseas MMO that practically relies on people buying credits.. not so great for a game that isn't trying to put too much pressure on buying credits.

See it really does come down to pressure. People feel pressure to join larger fleets rather than smaller ones, people feel pressured to do so even if those fleets are total bastards. The lucrative rewards however small, are more than they can get otherwise.

I like diversity, not monopoly. If all you do is give incentive for a monopoly, whats going to happen? Saying you have a choice is as ridiculous as saying instead of attacking a station with a Dread, use a scout. After all its your choice.

All this is really going to do is push people towards already big, larger fleets, and as this snowball effect occurs, more and more people find little reason to create a new fleet except in that the biggest one is already full.

I don't see fleets becoming groups of like minded people working together, just fleets that might as well be corporations.

Which is to me is really the only negative aspect I can find.


The Fridge
Chief Marshal
Templar Knights

Joined: December 13, 2008
Posts: 559
From: In Your Fridge, Eating your Foods.
Posted: 2011-06-21 10:20   
Dunno if it's already suggested, probably is.

What about scaling the amount of credits required each level depending on no. in the fleet.

If the number increases, credits will be taken out of the fleet and there level may decrease depending on if they have enough credits in the fleet to cover the entry of the new member.

If they do have enough credits then the fleet level would be the same.

If not, then at the server restart there level will go down. The Fleet would have till the server restart to pay in the funds required to stay on that level.

As the fleet number increases the amount they have to pay for each level will scale down gradually (Up to the Dev's to find that sweet spot).

Chewy Squirrel
Chief Marshal

Joined: January 27, 2003
Posts: 304
From: NYC
Posted: 2011-06-22 21:31   
I think tying some fleet benefits/level to the amount of planets the fleet owns would certainly make things more interesting...

Grand Admiral
Galactic Navy

Joined: April 30, 2002
Posts: 830
From: Land of Chocolate
Posted: 2011-06-26 00:59   
There are many potential problems, many of which have already been mentioned. I do like the ideas, however, and if implemented properly, can be potentially be very valuable.

So instead I'll focus on some suggestions.

One thing I would like to see with the implementation of such a system is the ability to place your fleet logo (if any) over the default UGTO ones on the hull. While likely requireing a LOT more work, it would be a cool little thing that fleets can have. (This can also be made rank dependent, a reflection of the influnce a fleet has, allowing a custom decal on their ships. You can even take this a step further, and allow high ranked fleets to set things like engine color (this DOES invalidate an enhancement, at least for fleets) and hull colors as well!) This would probably take more time then its worth though.

I also agree more can be done with fleets, and one thing I'd like to see is the possibility of a fleet ranking system, much like the one in game. That is, players ranked higher in the fleet would be able to order around lower ranked players in said fleet, but not vice versa. This may or may not override in game rank depending on what the devs decide. This really has no effect on unfleeted as well, the current ranking system applies in that case. You can tie this into the fleet leveling system. Level 0 gives you the current fleet ranking options. Level 1 would add a level inbetween basic and admin, and so on and so on. Fleets can name those levels whatever the heck they want, or devs can give those levels names.

Auras can be pretty much anything - depends on how specific you want to get.

Possibilities that I can think of - (Examples.)
Increased Damage (General)(Free) +1 dmg to all weapons.
Increased Damage (Beams/Cannons/Torpedoes/Missiles) +2 dmg to (weapon)
Increased Range (General)(Free) +1 range to all weapons
Increased Range (Beams/Cannons/Torpedoes/Missiles) +2 rng to (weapon)
And so on...
Increased (Rate of Fire, weapon travel speed, reduced reload times, ect)
Increased (Armor regen, hull regen (as if orbiting a planet) sheild regen)
Increased (Beam/Cannon/Torpedo/Missile) damage resistance.
Even reflected damage on attackers. (small)

Notice there is a basic level thats free. Unfleeted can add a general, weak bonus to all faction ships. When a more advanced type shows up, that value is used instead (it does not stack). This level of diversity, above, allows fleets to focus on particular, stronger auras that make them more effective, while unfleeted don't have this flexibility for a stronger, more specialized aura.
These auras can have levels much like that of enhancements.
A level 0 fleet has access to only the basic level (Only the general auras.)
A level 5 fleet has access to the Standard level (Specialized auras slightly higher then general)
A level 10 fleet has access to the Enhanced level (Specialized auras moderately higher then general aura.)
A level 15 fleet has access to the Advanced level (Specialized auras that are bigger then the last level, with the general aura buffed to the equivilant of the standard level. (+2 instead of +1))
This makes it so fleets can customize their auras to whatever situation they are in, providing a bonus for those who have collected more credits.
Another possible add in is a max level fleet can "design a ship" for their own personal use. They have to respect the value of each component and the max value of the hull. If they want to redesign, the fleet has to pay credits to do this. Each design has to meet a set of minimum requirements, or it is automatically rejected. If a fleet decides it wants to create a Torpedo dread, it can. But this torp dread will very likely be complete crap against anything cruiser sized and smaller. If they decide they want to make a ship like the K'Luth's core weapon dread, they can. But its defences will likely be lackluster and easily obliterated. Before they are added, all designs would have to be approved by dev teams, and restrictions can be adjusted based on balance requirements. These designs are likely to be very specialized, awesome at doing one thing, crap at anything else. Further, these custom ships can be made to be incompatible with enhancements, preventing exploitation of both systems to create a god-ship.

[ This Message was edited by: Tellaris on 2011-06-26 14:47 ]

Captain of the StarCruiser
I hit planets for fun!
Spellchecker, the POWER t00l


Joined: October 10, 2007
Posts: 268
Posted: 2011-06-26 23:06   
enhancements that appile only to command ships that whould supply bounes to the ships in group with it also would add a change in pace cause of the need to protect the command ship useing the bounes items cause it chould trun a defeat into victory or lead to doom
and the effect of the bonues whould be scaled to the fleets level give incitive to move as a group or work togeter

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ADmiraLMaXimus (Bringer of Doom)
Chief Marshal
Praetorian Wolves

Joined: March 09, 2002
Posts: 354
From: Earth
Posted: 2011-07-01 22:19   
in regards to existing fleets...... especially with large numbers.....

I say all existing fleet memebers be required to verify their email and account information and that the ip address be registered on that, to make sure that the same player on the same fleet with different accounts does not get counted towards the same fleets credit account. That I feel would be an exploit to this new fleet credit system.

Only one player per ip address per fleet.

so if you have 10 accounts you cannot simply add all those accounts into one fleet, But you can have each account if different fleets for that credit to apply to each fleet.

this may help get players that are in a fleet right now but not active to get active.

also by subtracting credits from a fleet due to players that do not register their info to make sure they are at least checking in once and a while would be good as well...
then maybe fleet admins would need to contact thier fleet players or delete them from their fleet in order to not have a debt due to so many inactive players

if your gonna do this you midas put in some rules so this does not get exploited.

here is my 6 basic rules:

1. only one account, per IP, per fleet, applies towards that fleets credit.

2. players in current fleets who have been grandfathered into this system must confirm their account via email to DS. (This request for confirmation will come from DS staff.) or when a fleet admin accepts a recruit.

3. any players who are in a fleet that have not confirmed their account will cause for their fleet to be penalized credits as long as they are unconfirmed players on that fleet.

4. current unconfirmed players can be removed from their fleet and may re-join later, once thier account is confirmed.

5. only players in fleets that are grand fathered in to this system and confirm their accounts within 30 days of this system being active will be considered grand fathered in to the system with their fleet as well.

6. players who are removed from fleets that are grand fathered in to this system in order to save credit for that said fleet will only be allowed to be grand fatehred into the system within the 30 days allowed. after 30 days if a players re-joins the same fleet they will not be part of that same system and the new rules will apply to adding that player which will then depend on the requisite rank of the fleet.

I just want to make this fair for everyone....

so if a fleet has 100 players in it and only 50 of them are active then they better speak to the other players that arent active or delete them from the fleet in order to get the full benefits of the other 50 active players Fleet credits

food for thought?
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