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[FAQ
Forum Index » » Developer Feedback » » 1.73 cloak changes
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 Author 1.73 cloak changes
The Fridge
Chief Marshal
Templar Knights


Joined: December 13, 2008
Posts: 557
From: In Your Fridge, Eating your Foods.
Posted: 2014-01-07 18:54   
Quote:
On 2014-01-07 18:38, Kinthalas wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-01-07 13:44, The Fridge wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-01-07 13:10, -xTc-.ExisT- *XO* wrote:
I can confirm this. It lowers the time to reach cloak and it also lowers the total time you can stay cloaked.

Also to note about the stealth mod, is that it doesn't reduce signature when your sig is negative...it increases it, as if its trying to get your sig closer to 0 rather than making it low as possible. I havent tested it but im assuming the brood aruas do the same thing because it is the same effect.




The first one is unintended.
The 2nd one is related to the cloak gadget needing 0 sig to cloak.
Thus increasing your sig when at negative sig.

[ This Message was edited by: The Fridge on 2014-01-07 13:44 ]




Not when cloaking or cloaked already.. just sitting there or flying etc. The enh/aura says sig reduction, and isn't kluth only. Once your sig is negative, it is adding to your sig.



Read again, Fairly sure I answered that, It increases the sig at negative sig to get closer to zero, this is because to cloak you need 0.
Thus making it faster to cloak, I'm fairly sure this wasn't adjusted in the Dev log.


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-xTc- ExisT
Chief Marshal
Army Of Darkness


Joined: March 20, 2010
Posts: 527
From: Red Lobster
Posted: 2014-01-07 19:22   
Quote:
On 2014-01-07 18:54, The Fridge wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-01-07 18:38, Kinthalas wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-01-07 13:44, The Fridge wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-01-07 13:10, -xTc-.ExisT- *XO* wrote:
I can confirm this. It lowers the time to reach cloak and it also lowers the total time you can stay cloaked.

Also to note about the stealth mod, is that it doesn't reduce signature when your sig is negative...it increases it, as if its trying to get your sig closer to 0 rather than making it low as possible. I havent tested it but im assuming the brood aruas do the same thing because it is the same effect.




The first one is unintended.
The 2nd one is related to the cloak gadget needing 0 sig to cloak.
Thus increasing your sig when at negative sig.

[ This Message was edited by: The Fridge on 2014-01-07 13:44 ]




Not when cloaking or cloaked already.. just sitting there or flying etc. The enh/aura says sig reduction, and isn't kluth only. Once your sig is negative, it is adding to your sig.



Read again, Fairly sure I answered that, It increases the sig at negative sig to get closer to zero, this is because to cloak you need 0.
Thus making it faster to cloak, I'm fairly sure this wasn't adjusted in the Dev log.






Except its not related to cloak at all. Stealth mod as you know has two effects, increase cloak rate and decrease signature.
When your sig is postive, the 'decrease signature' effect decreases it as it is supposed to.
When your sig is negative, the effect increases it which is not what it is supposed to do.
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The Fridge
Chief Marshal
Templar Knights


Joined: December 13, 2008
Posts: 557
From: In Your Fridge, Eating your Foods.
Posted: 2014-01-07 21:15   
Cloak make sig go zero

sig must get to zero to cloak

sig not zero, kluth not cloak

closer sig to zero, faster kluth cloak.


I'm not talking about the +15% cloak speed, I'm talking about the distance to 0.
In any case, unless they've changed how signature works and it hasn't been in the Dev log.
Any signature under something like -1.0 or 0.0 is meaningless as your minimum detection range won't change, If you want to be able to fire and be invisible check the kluth arsenal and have a friend jump in the ship that can assist in your endeavors.


This "Bug" has been in the game since the gadget was introduced.
Because It helped to set the sig as close to zero as possible
[ This Message was edited by: The Fridge on 2014-01-07 21:35 ]
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Forger of Destiny
Chief Marshal
We Kick Arse


Joined: October 10, 2009
Posts: 826
Posted: 2014-01-07 23:34   
reduction in total cloak time is a bad effect of the stealth module and related auras. must fix :/



since v1.7 (perhaps since earlier) the time between activating cloak and completely cloaking is independent of the signaure of the ship. so, trying to cloak at 0.1 signature and 25 signature will take the same amount of time.

still, the stealth-affecting stuff should simply not work below 0 signature, instead of increasing the final signature.



for those who are concerned with the maximum distance they can run up to under cloak, well,
scouts:- 1050 gu
frigates:- 1350 gu
destroyers and cruisers:- 1500 gu
dreads:- 1350 gu
stations (lol) :- 263 gu

i'll also point out, that the cloak time is just long enough to avoid being pursued by ships of lower class. a station can jump away, enter cloak and be hidden for 2.5 minutes, enough for a dread to jump in and then jump out. same with other ship classes (scouts have it easy).


im fairly surprised no one talked about how stations will work with cloak.
as far as i can imagine, a station can use cloak mainly passively, because of the long 20 seconds needed to enter cloak, it would be used primarily by hives and colonies to hide a deep space supply base from ships pursuing a damaged kluth ship. nests would use it in combat, which wont get them very far, or to escape pursuing dreads and cruisers (which will require plenty of luck).

[ This Message was edited by: Forger of Destiny on 2014-01-07 23:37 ]
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black


Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3820
From: LobsterTown
Posted: 2014-01-08 00:10   

There are a couple of things that need looking into.


1. When cloaking, the signature drop to 0 takes awfully long. Maybe that's fine. But can the ship be at least invisible (visually) once the cloak button is pressed?


2. Ships in negative sig. Shouldn't they cloak instantaneously, even under the current scheme, since the sig is already negative? I don't get why the sig needs to rise to 0. Neg sig, when going to cloak, should be treated as 0 sig.

I guess this may probably be related to how the Stealth Module is acting funny.



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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black


Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3820
From: LobsterTown
Posted: 2014-01-08 01:23   
Quote:
On 2014-01-07 23:34, Forger of Destiny wrote:


for those who are concerned with the maximum distance they can run up to under cloak, well,
scouts:- 1050 gu
frigates:- 1350 gu
destroyers and cruisers:- 1500 gu
dreads:- 1350 gu
stations (lol) :- 263 gu





scouts:- 1050 gu
frigates:- 1350 gu

less than >> destroyers and cruisers:- 1500 gu


Doesn't it seem strange to you that the cloak for frigs and scouts do not enable them to run further than dessies?

It's a bit off, when scouts aren't able to be "scouty" enough...
Clearly the cloak times for the two smallest classes need a bit of a tweak upwards.









[ This Message was edited by: Kenny_Naboo on 2014-01-08 01:25 ]
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Iwancoppa
Fleet Admiral

Joined: November 15, 2008
Posts: 709
Posted: 2014-01-08 03:15   
Quote:
On 2014-01-08 01:23, Kenny_Naboo wrote:
Quote:
On 2014-01-07 23:34, Forger of Destiny wrote:


for those who are concerned with the maximum distance they can run up to under cloak, well,
scouts:- 1050 gu
frigates:- 1350 gu
destroyers and cruisers:- 1500 gu
dreads:- 1350 gu
stations (lol) :- 263 gu





scouts:- 1050 gu
frigates:- 1350 gu

less than >> destroyers and cruisers:- 1500 gu


Doesn't it seem strange to you that the cloak for frigs and scouts do not enable them to run further than dessies?

It's a bit off, when scouts aren't able to be "scouty" enough...
Clearly the cloak times for the two smallest classes need a bit of a tweak upwards.









[ This Message was edited by: Kenny_Naboo on 2014-01-08 01:25 ]

Perhaps for frigates, not for scouts.


Scouts can already maneuver in such a way as to dodge the majority of incoming fire and have little difficulty ECM cloaking themselves...



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The Fridge
Chief Marshal
Templar Knights


Joined: December 13, 2008
Posts: 557
From: In Your Fridge, Eating your Foods.
Posted: 2014-01-08 12:37   
Quote:
On 2014-01-07 23:34, Forger of Destiny wrote:

since v1.7 (perhaps since earlier) the time between activating cloak and completely cloaking is independent of the signaure of the ship. so, trying to cloak at 0.1 signature and 25 signature will take the same amount of time.




No. I'm fairly sure that's this patch as it's not in the dev log after 1.7 when I last played with my stealth modules on icc and Kluth.
-With the cloak change having hard stats for cloaking.
Such as decloak time.

I'm on about why it reduced signature toward zero from it's inception.
I'm not arguing that aspect of the stealth module should stay, it's now irrelevant this patch and should be taken out. (It's been meh since it's inception for the negative cost)

Before that increase in sig toward zero for the cloak was beneficial along with the flat +15% cloak speed.


With the Ewar enh for all factions, the stealth module has no use with the new cloak mechanics.

[ This Message was edited by: The Fridge on 2014-01-08 12:39 ]
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Rykros1987
Fleet Admiral

Joined: October 01, 2012
Posts: 88
From: Not in an asylum. Yet.
Posted: 2014-01-12 15:02   
I have an idea if its acceptable:

1.keep the timer but make it range from 30-60 seconds. Bigger ships cloak longer.

2.Ditch the energy cost because it makes this the one asset in the game that can be completely nullified. Also massively hinders battle dps.

3.How to make ewar work? Simple. The cooldown will range from 50-150 percent of the duration based off of a 2 percent per signature point scale up to 50 sig.

This would seriously hinder their hit / run if they neglected ewar and would still prevent cloak until jd charge and prevent the problem of instant get out of jail free card use. I also think it would prevent much of the qq resentment from kluthies.

oh and if necessary decrease armor a little after testing it in beta?
[ This Message was edited by: rykros1987 on 2014-01-12 15:13 ]
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Ravendark
Marshal
Sanity Assassins


Joined: July 01, 2010
Posts: 441
Posted: 2014-01-29 03:10   
there's an very odd ping-like thing i noticed yesterday.
was just cruising downspace in my eclipse being all stealthy and cool, then couple of red riding hoods show up and one came a bit too close so i cloak. cloak cost is naturally zero as im so cool running in negative sig (hell yea). after im fully cloaked i turned of my array of ECM and it made my ship blink a bit and that little eye icon that shows stealth, was gone as well. therefore i take it that enemy saw me for a split second.

so now we are pinging ourselfs when deactivating ecm under cloak?

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