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Reload Drones |
Drafell
Grand Admiral
Mythica
Joined: May 30, 2003
Posts: 2449
From: United Kingdom
|  Posted: 2011-07-06 22:17
I would just like to clarify a few thing on how the AoE/AoI repair works:
Instead of repairing all ships within the field simultaneously, the device chooses one target within range to repair each second.
The repair target selection works on a round-robin basis.
More targets means a greater window between individual repair sessions.
Although a simultaneous system might be more preferred (IE. x repair/number of targets), the round-robin system is far more efficient for CPU usage.
Side notes:
There is general agreement that there needs to be an absolute limit on how fast a ship can repair. Although having depreciating returns on repair devices is my personal preferred option, the code necessary for this is actually quite complex and has to be implemented on a device by device basis. It also leads to additional CPU cycles being used due to the extra math involved.
Instead we are going to set an absolute limit on repair rate by a ships hull class, which is much more CPU efficient. The logic behind this is that there is only so much space a round a vessel in which repair drones can operate. Combined with a check to see if a hull is exceeding is current repair threshold, this should largely fix the issues we have had to date.
Assuming we choose a base constant of 10, a station could receive a maximum of 50 repair per second while a scout could only receive 10. This is not quite in scale with actual hull size, but given that a scout will still repair significantly faster than a station we feel it is a fair compromise.
The formula for this is: base constant * ( hull level / 2 )
I hope this helps players understand just how the new repairs fields actually work.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2011-07-06 22:45
Interesting. So it's not really an AOE repair field, it just automatically cycles repairs through what ships are in the area?
Does it take into account ships that don't need repairs but do need ammo reload?
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CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light
Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
| Posted: 2011-07-06 23:41
my biggest prob with your AOE system?
you can afk make press.
just spawn station, jump to deep space, build plats around, and turn on your drones.
come back at end of day, and log out.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-07-06 23:44
Quote:
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On 2011-07-06 22:45, Talien wrote:
Does it take into account ships that don't need repairs but do need ammo reload?
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Excellent question. I want to know this too. 
'Cuz there have been times where I'm undamaged and need an ammo reload, and the AI supp or plat (OK OK I know they're AIs... but I just wanna know if it's related since the AoE field is sorta AI too) just refuses to reload/resupp me.
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DiepLuc
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 23, 2010
Posts: 1187
| Posted: 2011-07-08 03:12
Quote:
| On 2011-07-06 22:17, Drafell wrote:
Assuming we choose a base constant of 10, a station could receive a maximum of 50 repair per second while a scout could only receive 10. This is not quite in scale with actual hull size, but given that a scout will still repair significantly faster than a station we feel it is a fair compromise.
The formula for this is: base constant * ( hull level / 2 ) |
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Isn't it less complicated if all the ships receive same amount? Let's take station as the standard, dev wants each second it retores 0.2%. Assuming station hull HP is 10 000 then each session, any ship receives 0.2%*10 000 = 20 HP. Then it would take approximately 8 minutes to repair a station from 1% to full. Smaller ship still repairs faster significantly with this method. It should be easier to modify the maximum repair time by adjusting the constant rate (0.2% for example) then setting the constant repair HP per second.
[ This Message was edited by: chlorophyll on 2011-07-08 03:22 ]
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Tommas [ USF HunnyBunny ]
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: February 04, 2006
Posts: 581
From: Norway
| Posted: 2011-07-08 19:53
Field repair...i just cant see why only Ugto gets it?
I dont either understand why it can be active at all times? Is it because the ugto planet campers can have an easier time?
The dev team seems to be prioritying server cpu rather then gameplan and fun these days, then i just cant see why you bring up a bad idea with field repair on Ugto station. Ill ask, will this not make more server cpu usage? And as ugto love spaming station, will this make a even more cpu usage?
I dont understand why not the old system is good enough, why change something that works and make it worse?
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Doran
Chief Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 29, 2003
Posts: 4032
From: The Gideon Unit
| Posted: 2011-07-08 20:19
Quote:
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On 2011-07-08 19:53, Tommas [ USF HunnyBunny ] wrote:
only Ugto gets it |
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odd. i dont recall seeing any mention that only ugto would get this repair field.
sure, they will of course get it on at least one station. but i can pretty much guarantee icc and kluth will have a station with one as well
and they say we're biased....
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Pantheon
Marshal
Palestar
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1789
| Posted: 2011-07-08 21:11
Quote:
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On 2011-07-08 19:53, Tommas [ USF HunnyBunny ] wrote:
I dont understand why not the old system is good enough, why change something that works and make it worse?
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Because it doesn't work. I'm not even going to bother reitterating all the reasons we've given over the past 4-5 months in the various topics that have been raised.
I don't even know where to begin with the rest of your post. Just.... WOW.
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*FTL*Soulless
Marshal
Joined: June 25, 2010
Posts: 787
From: Dres-Kona
| Posted: 2011-07-08 22:51
Quote:
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On 2011-07-08 21:11, Pantheon wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-07-08 19:53, Tommas [ USF HunnyBunny ] wrote:
I dont understand why not the old system is good enough, why change something that works and make it worse?
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Because it doesn't work. I'm not even going to bother reitterating all the reasons we've given over the past 4-5 months in the various topics that have been raised.
I don't even know where to begin with the rest of your post. Just.... WOW.
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I will make it easy and say it in one word. Balance
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Tommas [ USF HunnyBunny ]
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: February 04, 2006
Posts: 581
From: Norway
| Posted: 2011-07-09 03:39
Well only problem i see with the reload drones on ships is the abuse when to many players have stations etc. But i think the problem there could easily be fixed if you go back to the old system with one reload on combat and command stations. And two reload drones on supply stations. That is in my eyes the biggest problem when spamming stations in current MV.
As for the field repair, yes it will remove the current situation a tad. But its only one field repair and not all tree on the supply station. So it wont help that much.
Problems:
- Its always on auto, so whenever ppl jump in or are in the AoE they will always be reloaded, that means always got full jd and ammo.
- There will never be someone that ask for ammo and jd fuel anymore.
- The "skilled" part of looking around for someone to fix is gone, it will be the same with planet capping, Be there, then you could go to the fridge, look at some tv and come back to DS and clap your hands and tell you how good job u just have done.
- Did i mention that its always on?
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Thernhoghas
Grand Admiral
Exathra Alliance Fleet
Joined: September 18, 2010
Posts: 243
From: somewhere in Germany
| Posted: 2011-07-09 05:59
Quote:
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On 2011-07-09 03:39, Tommas [ USF HunnyBunny ] wrote:
Well only problem i see with the reload drones on ships is the abuse when to many players have stations etc. But i think the problem there could easily be fixed if you go back to the old system with one reload on combat and command stations. And two reload drones on supply stations. That is in my eyes the biggest problem when spamming stations in current MV.
As for the field repair, yes it will remove the current situation a tad. But its only one field repair and not all tree on the supply station. So it wont help that much.
Problems:
- Its always on auto, so whenever ppl jump in or are in the AoE they will always be reloaded, that means always got full jd and ammo.
- There will never be someone that ask for ammo and jd fuel anymore.
- The "skilled" part of looking around for someone to fix is gone, it will be the same with planet capping, Be there, then you could go to the fridge, look at some tv and come back to DS and clap your hands and tell you how good job u just have done.
- Did i mention that its always on?
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errm dude; it's not always on
otherwise it wouldn't be toggled with "I" (or "Y"; whatever key it is currently)
besides that; I don't get your problem. In release it is like that:
player XY has run out of ammo / JD fuel / whatever
-> player XY gets close to player Z, who is in an SS
-> player XY says something like "rep, pls" or even uses the supply distress call
-> player Z reloads player XY
where is the skill in that?
considering your last part about planet capping:
as far as I remember, two or more mods already mentioned that planets are likely to be buffed again soon. Just wait "Two Weeks" and you'll see
[ This Message was edited by: Thernhoghas on 2011-07-09 06:00 ]
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DiepLuc
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 23, 2010
Posts: 1187
| Posted: 2011-07-09 11:46
I read Drafell explanation about the round-robin load. However, I don't completely understand it due to my bad English skill.
Shall you make simple diagram demonstating how repair field work?
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-07-09 12:36
Quote:
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On 2011-07-09 11:46, chlorophyll wrote:
I read Drafell explanation about the round-robin load. However, I don't completely understand it due to my bad English skill.
Shall you make simple diagram demonstating how repair field work?
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It simply means that if there are 2 ships that need reps, in the AoE, then they will take turns within a given time frame/cycle to get repaired. Eg. 1 second. A gets repped for half second, then B for a half second, then back to A again.
If there are 3 ships, then within that one sec, A gets repped for 1/3 secs, followed by B, then C, then back to A again.
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Pantheon
Marshal
Palestar
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1789
| Posted: 2011-07-09 16:31
The more players in the AOE field, the longer it takes for the repairs to complete.
Person A repaired
+ 1 second
Person B repaired
+ 1 second
Person C repaired
+ 1 second
Person A repaired
+ 1 second
Person B repaired
Etc
Etc
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Iwancoppa
Fleet Admiral
Joined: November 15, 2008
Posts: 709
| Posted: 2011-07-09 19:51
Will stations be able to self-repair with the AOE repairer? If not, then stations are now useless :S
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