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MoA on strike... read the news |
Teager
Cadet
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 317
From: St Augustin, Germany
|  Posted: 2002-11-12 04:59
Yule, I understand your point, that you want to keep your advantage. But the advantage the K'luth has atm is too big!
I played K'luth several times on FA and it's more slaughtering than fighting.
So plz try to be objective. I know it's hard but give it a try!
btw, I was talking about FA, it's nearly impossible to join K'luth when the scenario is runnign for a while. Because you get easy combat Prestige.
In MV it is something completely different. ICC has many players because they like this faction even if it is weaker than K'luth.
I'm sorry but my english isn't good enough to express 100% of ehat I want to.
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Schakal*
Cadet
eXcellent Strategists
Joined: December 16, 2001
Posts: 664
| Posted: 2002-11-12 06:13
Make Armor UGTO only, so the UGTO stop crying. Yes, K'luth will cry ICC to, i like that armor more then Active shilds, but to balance the game better i would have no problem to not to keep the armor. And when i say remove Armor UGTO only, no more heavy armors on ICC ships! And to Patlukowsky. No one said something about his "not so nice" reaction. But i can feel with Patlukowsky! I know a lot of closed beta players. I'm very sure if they would still play Coombie would be around the 10th place. Back to topic... And again for players that don'T accept that they can'T fight against a enemy fleet. You only rock in a team!
No more comment!
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Malor
Admiral
Joined: November 27, 2001
Posts: 232
From: Utrecht, the Netherlands
| Posted: 2002-11-12 07:43
Oh man, a few months ago it were the luthies that were the punching bag, and now it's the ICC...
A strike of players to get what you want? Aint that a bit drastic?
But in all seriousness: what exactly is the idea behind this? Why deny ICC the chance to take Heavy Armor? I do not understand the motivation behind it.
And an Assault Cruiser is meant to take on Dreads/Stations and win. That is why I love it. As for the rest, see the Development Log.
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[ This Message was edited by: Malor on 2002-11-12 07:48 ]
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Hitman23
Grand Admiral
Joined: March 22, 2002
Posts: 585
From: WoW
| Posted: 2002-11-12 08:27
I for one think that the factions are pretty close to being balanced.
The Kluth may have extra firepower but they cannot take a beating nor can they fire backwards. Ever notice that there are few dreads about? You get behind one of their dreads and they either have to jump or they are dead. One of the best things to fire at a Kluth ship is fighters (UGTO excels at this) due to their lack of PD. The Hive may have more armour and better weapons but come on, you stay out of beams range and dodge the torps and the Hive is dead too. Unless they have a large fleet on, anything above a dessie is just cannon fodder. They also play very well together, they have to.
The ICC have numbers to their advantage right now. Before they were one of the most inactive factions but that has all changed. They have pretty good teamwork as well, I have been so close to dying many times and they all jump in to save the wounded ship. They are able to fly dreads etc because they stick together, they move as a pack and kick butt along the way. I think they are pretty much on par with UGTO as far as weapons. The EAD should have 4 weapon slots to match the AD but that's all I think. As I said before, the reason they do so well is they are in large groups.
The UGTO have lost their teamwork. I know that they were a great faction before but either the MV has become too boring or FA too exciting. They do not answer calls to the MV. The largest fleet is inactive as far as the MV goes but we all know what they can do when they are on. When the UGTO plays and the numbers are there, they are pretty much unstoppable. The people that do play only seem to attack as single ships so of course they are going to die. An example of the teamwork they have......I was a UGTO station with another fleet, the other fleet also had a station and about 5 other ships. We outnumbered the Kluth and we were attacking a Kluth system. There was only a four planet cluster to attack and we had one of the planets already. We all jumped in to cap another of the planets, the stations were to drop the inf and the other ships were to protect us. We were getting beat on pretty good from the planets and the few kluth we decided to retreat. The smaller ships all jumped out and I was about to when i noticed the other station was about to die. I turn around and place myself over top of him to protect him while I had both my reloads on him. No one came back to help, we, the 2 stations, were pretty much waiting to die. All of a sudden the station I came back for disappeared, now I was all alone. I then see him in a new station just entering the system. He said he died but with me being on top of him, I would have died in the explosion as well. I was left to die alone and that I did. I have yet to see anything like this happen with the ICC as they stick together and I know Kluth do the same.
So tell me, is it really the ships? I know I have died in every ship in the game regardless of faction. I have also killed every ship in the game regardless of faction. It all boils down to using what you have to your advantage. The UGTO seem to be in a slump right now but all factions have gone through this. I do not agree with boycotting the MV to make things better, they only way they will get better is to get numbers in the MV. You need to increase moral not make it worse.
Just my 2 cents..
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Deleted
Grand Admiral
Joined:
Posts: 0
| Posted: 2002-11-12 12:06
Oh man reading this thread is annoying.
Flux:
You IDIOTS.
Flux wave does around 4500 damage. So if you mount 4 of them you *oh oh oh M A T H* do enough damage to punch through REACTIVE shields.
You mount active shields and you don't have a problem.
Or you mount heavy armor.
Yes the larger ICC ships need to have active shields mounted on them by default. But apparently thats at the bottom of the priority list.
But quite simply, upgrade your shields/armor. That absorbs the damage from the 4 flux wave ships.
As for EMP:
Look at how many UGTO ships mount emp as a default? In scenerio there is emp flying all over a battle, that's why your systems get annihilated.
Nobody uses EMP on UGTO in the MV, simply because we NEED WEAPONS THAT DO DAMAGE! In scenerio UGTO mounts flux because the UGTO torps are totally outclassed by the ICC ones, flux is easy to make, and flux scouts disable any icc ship with default shields.
I have seen a few flux ships in the MV. Namely 2 scouts. There was one flux BD i've seen recently, but he didn't last long enough to let his flux recharge.
______
This 'stop whining and learn how to fly/teamwork' is pathetic.
If the ICC would pay attention to the last few days of MV combat, they'd see that it's been 10-15 ICC ships vs 3-6 UGTO, and guess what:
We've held them off for HOURS, and in a number of cases recapped planets.
Why? Because i've watched ICC fleet after ICC fleet have a FEW ships jump to a planet, or not even to a planet just 5k gu from a planet, then get hit by the UGTO ships while THE REST OF THE ICC FLEET SITS AND WATCHES THEM DIE.
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In the end it all comes down to the ships and pilots.
UGTO has several large highly experienced fleets. We have a larger core of experienced pilots than the ICC have. That's been what's saving us from total annihilation.
That and the Kluth aren't attacking with the ICC.
But I don't care how good you are, you're going to lose when the enemy ships are faster, more manuverable and have heavier weapons.
Look at the TC: 5 heavy weapons, 1 of them forward mounted and 1 special slot.
In combat you have to keep your speed under 20gu/s just to keep your energy up. And most of the time you're not facing your opponent, because if you do, you can't dodge their torps since you turn so SLOWLY with the heavy armor.
AC: 5 heavy weapon slots (I don't believe any of them are forward mounted) and 1 full mount mine 2 special slots.
So, if you mod up an AC with armor (0 energy drain) and two reactors how quickly can you fly and still keep up a steady stream of fire? All I know is that I'm stuck in battles fighting in an assault destroyer being chased by ACs who are going as fast as I am and pounding me with torps. Also, how does armor and reactors impact your max turn radius? TC's with MV mods turn at 11 degrees/s -- I'm curious about this because it seems your ships turn MUCH faster
So right there you have ships that are more heavilly armed, can fly at higher speeds and keep firing, and most likely turn better.
Then there is the AD/EAD
AD's have an extra special slot, which is well and good for having much more energy.
But this is not much of a trade off when you consider that the EAD has an extra heavy weapon slot and the extra cannons.
____________
There's a reason why some of the best ICC pilots, Jimmy and Rogue EASILLY annihilate UGTO ships. You can hold a higher top speed and still fight, have more weapons and you mount shields--turn faster and you can easilly dodge everything.
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NoPants2win
Cadet
Joined: February 23, 2002
Posts: 1275
From: Poorly ventilated paint storage facility.
| Posted: 2002-11-12 12:26
Your losing because its 3 vs 1, not because your ship is a POS. But yeah the uglies are at a disadvantage when fighting the more heavily armed faster ICC ships. Really tho, stop using your flux on shields let a teamate take down 1 shield arc (the icc almost never focus their shields, its damn funny) and then use your flux once he ejumps out. Its basically the way the kluth fight but we have extra firepower instead of flux but we still come in with drainer following shell.
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Naufragus the Hashishin
Midshipman
Joined: September 17, 2001
Posts: 1253
From: Dallas, Los Angeles, Paris
| Posted: 2002-11-12 12:50
basically the icc gets everything on its wish list....
they wanted rotating shield...they got rotating shields
they wanted armor.....they got armor
they wanted better shields.....they get active shileds
they wanted a pusle shield....they got a pulse shield
they wanted a guass gun ......they got that and never use it
they wanted tracking torps.....they got tracking torps
now i hear they are even going to get an auxillery shield
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Lith Ragond
Cadet
Galactic Navy
Joined: November 25, 2001
Posts: 1854
| Posted: 2002-11-12 23:41
first off i would like to thank Pat for standing up for GTN.
second, i would let MoA know that i am very disapointed in them. making their strike public, AND making demands is out of line. something like this should only have been taken to the admins. instead, you brought it to the forums where it escalates into a flame war. very bad idea.
third. the problem with the UGTO is not a simple. yes it is a lack of numbers, but those numbers are due to the fact that people are sick of trying to out pace superior ICC ships. in the MV, there is no question as to who can have the best ships. this makes a situation where two pilots of equal value know where the fight will end, with the UGTOs hull in millions of peices.
have this scene repeated to you literally hundreds of times, and it gets old fast. many UGTO have lost their resolve in the MV. i lost mine at the very end of the UGTOs golden era, months ago. i was burned out from leading raid after raid into ICC space, and 2 out of 3 times having nothing to fight until we had the system as good as capped.
thats when the UGTO actually began this long decline. we had our go at it, and stopped really worrying. but the ICC were at a breaking point, and they began striking back, and havent stopped since.
this is simply a cycle that goes on and on. first the ICC were the broken ones, not fighting back, while the Kluth stomped around. now its the ICCs turn on top. i suspect as Kluth havent been on the bottom of the ladder, there time is coming up.
and as whenever things seem unfair, people scream bloody murder. sure, there are certain ship balances that need to be taken into account. they have seemed small in the past. thats why nothing has been done. but as the player base of DS evolves, those flaws in design are brought out, and we can only sit through till it is fixed.
last of all, i would request, for the good of the players, that this thread at the LEAST be locked. it can no turn into anything besides a flame war. and i am certain it will escalate. maybe not in this thread, but due to this thread i suspect certain things will come to pass.
[edit]
i would also like to point out to the UGTO. no matter if you believe it or not, the UGTO is where is at because of US. the UGTO hasnt stepped up for a while. when your enemy rises to power, we cant excpect to give it our usual. we have to rise with them. i know i am guilty of the opposite, my poor excuse is because i burned myself out.
simply, the UGTO need a leader. one hasnt realy risen yet (or else i havent seen one), because the UGTO are still at such a weak state. perhaps one will arise, perhaps not. but UGTO wont be at the bottom for ever, trust me.
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Fleet Admiral,
Captain of the NSS Iringul,
2IC of the GTN, Protector of Sol,
K'luth/Human Hybrid
[ This Message was edited by: Lith Ragond on 2002-11-12 23:45 ]
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Jim Starluck
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: October 22, 2001
Posts: 2232
From: Cincinnati, OH
| Posted: 2002-11-12 23:51
*applauds Lith*
Most sensible post I've seen in this thread yet.
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Ramius
Fleet Admiral
Agents
Joined: January 12, 2002
Posts: 894
From: Ramius
| Posted: 2002-11-13 00:03
Yeah, I agree with Lith.
As I keep saying to people.... there is a difference between bravery and stupidity. Most of the experienced pilots realize that. Its basic logistical reasons why UGTO are on bottom...
Each patch the balance sways back and forth, from one faction to another... Just hope it sways in your direction.
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Admiral Ramius of the Agents.
Servant of the High Council
[ This Message was edited by: Ramius on 2002-11-13 00:04 ]
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NoPants2win
Cadet
Joined: February 23, 2002
Posts: 1275
From: Poorly ventilated paint storage facility.
| Posted: 2002-11-13 00:35
We were on the bottom for a long, long time. I have pics of 7 pb bombing with transports.
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You sir, have an incurable case of rationality. I'm afraid the only thing you can do is develop a deep cynicism before the stress of searching for something you cannot find causes a stroke.
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Bumblebee
Cadet
Mercenaries of Andosia
Joined: May 31, 2001
Posts: 2256
From: Switzerland
| Posted: 2002-11-13 08:48
i made a mistake, sorry, my fault
i should have locked the topic, after my initial post here
so, i did not inform the one who care, but created a new black hole of slamming and misbehaviour
i correct this error now
thanks to the (few) poster, who jumped above the (normal?) level of "learn to fly / stop whining ... and so on"
to the rest of you, i am once more ashamed about your reaction
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