| Author |
kluth surply broken |
Tellaris
Grand Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: April 30, 2002
Posts: 830
From: Land of Chocolate
|  Posted: 2005-07-22 03:04
As far as I understand the factions are supposed to be:
ICC: Defensive, their technology seems to focus on planets and protecting their ships from fire (Pulse, Sheilds, Planetary Sheild Base)
UGTO: The middle, good firepower, good armor. No special planetary structures, Defense bases shoot good amount of missiles and PD CL 300's. Ships have best armor, no sheilds. Have good weapons.
K'Luth: Offensive, geared for hit and run. Little to no armor, many powerful weapons. No Special planetary structures, what appears to be poor planet PD, with strong but short ranged PSI missiles. (or whatever the heck they are called now) Only defence is poor PD and cloak. Their ships probobly should be faster then human ships for this purpose, but arn't.
As for the supply issue, I lost a supply in like 1 second to a freindly QST... Mind you, only lvl 4 armor. I'm sure ICC suffers the same way, so why should the K'Luth be any different? I say if you're gonna beef up supplies, do it to ALL of them. Otherwise, supplies should hang back and repair ships as they become damaged, mearly staying a safe distance away. (An interdictor becomes necessary for this purpose) Its no longer possible for a supply to stay within battle and not get whacked in a few seconds. So just stay out of it!
_________________
Captain of the StarCruiser
I hit planets for fun!
Spellchecker, the POWER t00l
|
JackSwift
Cadet
Sundered Weimeriners
Joined: October 30, 2002
Posts: 1806
From: Where the Sun dont Shine (Seattle-ish)
| Posted: 2005-07-22 04:34
Quote:
|
On 2005-07-21 23:59, Toifle wrote:
so just as a question,
Would a UGTO or ICC dread not be invulnerable with 8 supplies?
|
|
I think Backy's point is that a K'luth dread with 8 cloaked supplies would be invulnerable if sups could reload while cloaked. Of course, firing a ton of QST's at that dread would fix the supply problem, but that still leaves the ICC in the lurch...
Now the last time I played K'luth was in 1.480, so I won't even begin to argue over which tactics are correct and yada yada. But right now it seems like both sides are not on the same page, or even willing to look at it. I'll try my best to condense this into a few, succint phrases.
Camp 1: The K'luth supply does not function the way it was intended to. Therefore, it should be fixed.
Camp 2: The K'luth are not using the supply the way it was intended to, and therefore is running into problems that could be fixed if they used them the right way.
Well, how about this idea: set "levels" of reloading. Perhaps a "light" reload setting for the K'luth that boost auto repair by a small bit, but expend little energy, drones and decrease their sig (or cloaking timer, whatever) by a little. "Medium" (normal) reload settings use drones like they are now. "Heavy" would then obviously be really taxing on energy, drones and sig, but you get repaired quickly.
So, let's say you're in a Hive in the middle of a battle over an enemy planet. You're getting pounded by a UGTO fleet that appeared to respond to the planet's distress signal. Now you have a few choices: perhaps try and slink away using a light repair (cloak faster, but leaves you a little more defenseless because of slower repair) or try and muscle through the battle with an increased repair rate but a larger sig and higher energy drain. Now, judging from what some K'luth players have said, slinking away in the middle of a batlle is usually not the best tactic. So, instead, why not pump up your defense for a few minutes and try to take the heat off of other fleetmates? It may just give them the time they need to disengage or get reinforcements or counterattack or...
Also think about the supplies. If they wanted to help a ship immediately, they would then use the heavy and expose themselves to danger. Otherwise they could fly through battles on low, trying to avoid detection and increasing the longevity of the fleet.
Perhaps instead of changing the sig, each setting would be 'visible' or 'not visible'. Heavy being always visible and low being not visible.
_________________
(too lazy to rehost that old sig)
\"Errare Human Est.\"
|
Razor
Cadet
Joined: June 11, 2004
Posts: 200
From: Fayetteville, North Carolina (USA)
| Posted: 2005-07-22 06:29
Back to the subject of this post please! Can something be done to fix the K'luth supply ships? Not being able to use repair drones while cloaked is the problem here and the reason for this thread.
_________________
Razor
The Praetorian Wolves
We are many. We are one.
|
MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2005-07-22 07:41
This game revolves around planets. Defending them, bombing them and capping them. The combat is a fun feature but the object of the game is to cap and defend planets.
In this regard ICC are the best.
What does this have to do with Kluth supply ships? Nothing. I have mixed feelings on Kluth supply not being able to reload when cloaked. For one, they're too fragile to be taken into combat and so are better suited to stay away and have damaged ships come to them. On the other hand, if they could reload when cloaked they'd be better suited to being in combat with their fleets, doing what they're supposed to be doing.
So I have mixed feelings.
_________________
|
Ragglock
Marshal
BIOnics Industry Syndicate
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1955
From: Denmark
| Posted: 2005-07-22 09:07
think we should calm down just a bit 
even i got a bit to personally in some ways there and i apologize for that.
i didn’t start this thread for to be page after pager of personal attacks on each other and their mother.
and this is not about bombing or tactics
back to subject:
first as the kluth supply worked before.
you needed to decloak to activate the supply drones but as soon as it started you could cloak again.
this gave enemy time to see that actual an supply around and target them or go look for them
this posed a risk for the supply ship in the short time where it had to decloak to start supplying.
also made supplying more than an art for the supply pilot’s since it took timing to do it and awareness without getting wasted them self not to talk about the danger than 1 alpha from FF can kill them to if they get in front of a friendly dred by mistake.
even before this change was made supplying for kluth was not for the kiddies.
i would not like to se more armor on the surply as the solution as some states kluth meant to be weak in armor that’s true and the only way they could compensate for that fact that an single cruzz or qst or 1 fighter launch form a carrier can snuff them is that they could cloak and selfsurply from time to time.
but they should not be weak in ships that emphasize team work.
all comment that you can have 8 surply supplying one dred, well when have anyone ever encountered an ugto fleet in battle where there was not 1 supply supplying each dred.
this have never been the way kluth works surply have always been sparse in numbers at most 1- 2 for a hole squad of 8 -10 ships.
it always been very rare that we had 1 supply covering each ship for not to say never.
btw plz tell me why the kluth top ships the hives should not be able to hide and supply their fleets or them self because they can’t cloak while doing so?.
and why is that ?
that’s a big side effect of actual adjusting 1 device that affects more than one ship class.
if the human fraction station was without supply drones on the station do you think they would last long even with the more 300 % armor they have?
with this change the hives was rendered a none option for long range attacks and center points for any force.
if hives cant recive surply and stayhiden when dammage to the brink of destruction, they just to weak to be used.
any surply around them surplying dammage would just paint a big read target plate on the hive and work as an beacon nr 2 that the enemy can shoot after becaus of surply ships have to be unhiden.
_________________
P:@12 C:$38
LOVE the smell of human flesh in the morning smells like MVictory
|
Lark of Serenity
Grand Admiral
Raven Warriors
Joined: June 02, 2002
Posts: 2516
| Posted: 2005-07-22 12:23
you have a supply station - supply stations are NOT combat ships, they shouldnt be anywhere near the fight, or if they are in the middle of a fleet, so that there is no risk to them. the idea here is that they should either be so well protected or so out of reach that they wont be attacked
battle station - it hides until it attacks... nuff said
that other station thingy - i havent really gotten that one yet, im guessing its for building? again... heavy protection
youll not the supply station is supposed to either be away or well protected? same goes for supply ships. tney dont need to be able to cloak and repair at the same time, for the same reason u cant fire and cloak at the same time. it is NOT fun for the other players to see a mandy raising hull rapidly, and nothing u can do about it. newbie fleets would be screwed. ICC ion cannon wouldnt do enough dmg to kill them all, and whos to say a veteran fleet could field one neways? theres plenty of admirals missing their EADs/ADs right now.
there might be another fix, but even if u make the supply faster, what good would it do? youre flying with dreadnaughts usually, so its not like u can be running at ridiculous speed and supplying them at the same time.
i dont know, i feel that kluth supplies are standoff supplies, not combat supplies. the support station if anything is what you have for combat supplying.
_________________
Admiral Larky, The Wolf
Don't play with fire, play with Larky.
Raven Division Command - 1st Division
|
Tikki
Cadet
Raven Warriors
Joined: March 10, 2005
Posts: 132
From: Canuckistan
| Posted: 2005-07-22 15:39
I'm beginning to think that the K'luth suppy should have more armor added if it's going to be that vulnerable. Even if they stay back from battle waiting to supply those who come to it, anyone with half a mind will attempt to track and pop it.
_________________
I'm going to start wounding you now. I don't know when I'll stop.
Commander of the Missle Cruiser 'Nevermore'
|
Ragglock
Marshal
BIOnics Industry Syndicate
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1955
From: Denmark
| Posted: 2005-07-22 16:06
ik im off cant get thrugh to some thik heads that never played kluth
all i can say that we cant use surplys in battel like icc and ugto can is the true down fall of kluth, to many strings an limmits
quick example anyone noticed al lkluth desotyers basical all the same now
there is no diffrence in armor weapons or engines as before al lmade from the same template so actuly only 1 kind of destoyer to select
our hives are not usefull becaus the lesser armor than any icc/ ugto station + you cant surply self on them makes them flying coffines in and out battel zone
so there we have no options
all kluth bombers have 1 lesser bomber slot that the icc / ugto counter parts and still icc / ugto can basical outbomb any kluth ship
all ships from destroyer class and below cant move more than 1/3 its max speed without losing cloake even if they dont recharge weapons or anything
lol the scout cant cloake at all only 1 engine and al lpower get sucked out of the cloake in 5 sec if it does
kluth have only no armor option compared to icc/ugto 4 options atleast
we just got the power lvls raised on the biger dred ships and same time they cant upgrade the power gens higer lvl than 2
fire 1 time and all power goes out even with 5 power gens installed and pfe drives.
best thing the surposly strike first and hard cant strikefirst becaus the enemy can see you 5 - 10 sec before you have a chance to fire the weapons so thats out.
out planets shoots us in the back trying to defend the bomber onslaught from both icc and ugto bombers.
samer time al lbombs from fighter bombers and bombers of diffreent kind just by passes the kluth defence that just shoots blanks in the air.
we cant stay hiden try to defend and get spamed with fighters the sec you try to defend uncloaked.
you get constant pinged by eccm ecm
while all this been going on
noone have even been thinking about lvling out the splash dammage the ugto qst have
or checked that neutron bombs have bigger splash dammage than any bio lvl bomb.
and this list can go on forever.
its the uber nerf that tells us that kluth should be taken out of ds completly
you cant keep on upgrading ugto / icc and same time downgrading kluth
but on the other hand thats whats some have wantet all the time might be their plan get kluth so nerfed you cant play it so i cant just stand by and let the a. h. just wreck them to the ground.
to bad liked playing them ds wil lhave a loss without them its gona be icc mds and ugto stations all from now on.
nothing else....
i just wantet one thing fixed then mabye i could live with some of the above the ablity to actuly stay hiden while you repair other ships and your own.
if tats tomuch to ask then you f uped in your mind
_________________
P:@12 C:$38
LOVE the smell of human flesh in the morning smells like MVictory
|
BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11183
From: Bristol, England
| Posted: 2005-07-22 16:17
You still dont get it...
Imagine you Ragg, in one Siphon, with 5 or more cloaked supplies. You'd be untouchable, and we would be unable to target the supplies, because we cant see them. Its just about ok for us UGTO, we can use the QST, and thats IF they are within 250 gu, level 10 reloads can reload at 500 gu's.
It would be almost impossible trying to manualy target the supplies WHILST your there, in your invunrable Siphon, kicking the jesus out of all of us. One or two might get caught in crossfire, but anyone can see that coming and compensate.
_________________
|
Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2005-07-22 17:39
Ok. For any true Kluth reading this, Make sure you are sitting down.
RAGGLOCK, I AGREE WITH YOU 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That may be a first.
What you don't get, folks, is the fact that ALL OF THOSE THINGS TOGETHER is what is screwed up. If we have the pathetic timer as it is on cloak, as well as the drain of energy the thing uses, then our better ships should be the destroyers and cruisers. If you are going to nerf the destroyers and cruisers, so that they are beam happy energy hogs if you move more than 15gus, then the cloak should be instantaneous. The slower you make us, the weaker our armor, the better our supplies had better be. But that isn't the case either.
And I pity the dumb ass in a Hive that dares to uncloak anywhere near an enemy to perform it's function as a supply station. I AM NOT KIDDING THAT THING WILL NOT KILL A MODDED FRIGATE!!!!!!!!!!!!
The last version was closer to what Kluth should have been. The lower end ships, the ones with a little better speed, were better than the bruisers. Well, except the cruisers really stunk. We had the best destroyers in the game. The ICC had the best cruisers, though that Torp Cruiser is a force to be reckoned with. The UGTO had the top muscle, the Dreads of dread.
Well, we lost our destroyers, our cruisers still can't move at cruiser speed, our stations are rightfully afraid to decloak, and I haven't seen a soul in an Adv. tranny. Meanwhile the humans have gotten stronger, and the game is tipped way out.
Now, what is sad, is that here WE sit, and tell YOU what we are weakest at. You sit and tell us we are wrong. But this is veteran, hard core Kluth talking here, not some average noobs. I just wonder how long it is before ya'll realize, if you do trully believe otherwise, how weak we are, and start farming the aliens.
I do know this. If I were on UGTO or ICC, I'd be exterminating.
Az
_________________
bucket link
|
Xpli$it
Marshal
Joined: March 06, 2004
Posts: 486
From: Canada
| Posted: 2005-07-22 17:49
To be fair, ugto supps die in one alpha too, I admit when I see a ship with a supp I take the supp out first with one alpha to lower chances of the other ship... so armour or not all supps run the same risk
_________________
|
Russian Roulette with Muskets
Grand Admiral
Joined: September 04, 2002
Posts: 393
| Posted: 2005-07-22 17:49
Quote:
|
On 2005-07-22 17:39, Smokey Bear wrote:
Ok. For any true Kluth reading this, Make sure you are sitting down.
RAGGLOCK, I AGREE WITH YOU 100%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That may be a first.
What you don't get, folks, is the fact that ALL OF THOSE THINGS TOGETHER is what is screwed up. If we have the pathetic timer as it is on cloak, as well as the drain of energy the thing uses, then our better ships should be the destroyers and cruisers. If you are going to nerf the destroyers and cruisers, so that they are beam happy energy hogs if you move more than 15gus, then the cloak should be instantaneous. The slower you make us, the weaker our armor, the better our supplies had better be. But that isn't the case either.
And I pity the dumb ass in a Hive that dares to uncloak anywhere near an enemy to perform it's function as a supply station. I AM NOT KIDDING THAT THING WILL NOT KILL A MODDED FRIGATE!!!!!!!!!!!!
The last version was closer to what Kluth should have been. The lower end ships, the ones with a little better speed, were better than the bruisers. Well, except the cruisers really stunk. We had the best destroyers in the game. The ICC had the best cruisers, though that Torp Cruiser is a force to be reckoned with. The UGTO had the top muscle, the Dreads of dread.
Well, we lost our destroyers, our cruisers still can't move at cruiser speed, our stations are rightfully afraid to decloak, and I haven't seen a soul in an Adv. tranny. Meanwhile the humans have gotten stronger, and the game is tipped way out.
Now, what is sad, is that here WE sit, and tell YOU what we are weakest at. You sit and tell us we are wrong. But this is veteran, hard core Kluth talking here, not some average noobs. I just wonder how long it is before ya'll realize, if you do trully believe otherwise, how weak we are, and start farming the aliens.
I do know this. If I were on UGTO or ICC, I'd be exterminating.
Az
|
|
ugto/support stations cant kill anything too...
_________________
- In firepower we trust.
- I'm not buying this!
-we ran out of firepower.
|
|
English
Deutsch
Nederlands
)
