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Planet defences |
DarkScorpion
Marshal
Sanity Assassins
Joined: September 14, 2004
Posts: 237
From: London England
|  Posted: 2009-03-27 03:06
Planet defences are just far too weak to realy kill anything unless its already got one foot in the grave, i watched a pirate bomber dessie jump in around 1900gu from sag hoth flying in more or less a straight line towards the planet ill asume its max speed would of been 18gu though it looked more like 15gu at a planet with a mixture of lvl 3 and lvl 1 kluth defence bases and still managed to attack planet and hit it has nothing to do with how planet is built as even though it has leaph like 600gu from sag hoth it can slow down to a slow crawl and bomb more or less freely and still survive and fall back from two planets attacking it at almost point blank range, If kluth beams dont kill you like that im sure ugto beams wont too
if a ai dumb ass bomber can do it i would expect a player of limited ability could do so no trouble, can we please return to 483 damage levels at least
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DarkNoble
Fleet Admiral
Joined: August 02, 2005
Posts: 25
| Posted: 2009-03-27 03:52
Or come out with top sercet lvl 4-5 def =p 250 pop wowow
and .. can re-layout sips/ead/ad give them more a punch =p
Dreads need more jump fuel =)
sips need more assrupers less failling at drainnig other ppl nrg
Ead fluxbeams ... comon they need to hull faster to use there overpower has it is wave flux.. so give them more cannos =p
Ad=... havent seen 1 in combat..latey why not instead of 2 ions when u shoot 1 slot u see 4=p oooo00
[ This Message was edited by: FX-05 on 2009-03-27 03:53 ]
[ This Message was edited by: FX-05 on 2009-03-27 03:53 ]
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Don Nukey of ICC *CO*
Chief Marshal
Interstellar Cultural Confederation United
Joined: June 05, 2006
Posts: 429
From: Zeebrugge, belgium
| Posted: 2009-03-27 04:53
the dev log said something about tweaked defence bases for the 1.517 version in beta
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JBud
Marshal
Joined: February 26, 2008
Posts: 1900
From: Behind you.
| Posted: 2009-03-27 05:32
- Tweaked planetary defense bases
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t500
Marshal
Joined: June 20, 2007
Posts: 188
From: vermont
| Posted: 2009-03-27 11:27
MrSparkle
Cadet
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There's virtually no difference, for Kluth bases anyway. Level 2 bases get mark II missiles, which is just a laggier spammier version of regular (two missiles instead of one). Level 3 bases get the regular level 1 base missiles plus torpedoes.
So for Kluth, level 1 gives regular Psi Missiles and a weak beam. Level 2 gives Psi Missile mark II which is two missiles, and a weak beam. Level 3 gives regular Psi Missiles, a torpedo which is decent vs close range, and a weak beam.
The missiles do very very little damage, and level 2 bases have the potential to create a lot of lag. For some reason instead of mark IIs being one missile with twice the damge, they're two missiles.
Defense base weapons should get a substantial damage increase, because I still don't see the point in upgrading to level 3 bases. It's possible that level 2 bases might be more desirable than level 1 now, but level 3? Nope. They require 90 tech, turn off if 1 lab is destroyed, and don't do enough damage at range to be worth it (close range damage should be a bonus exclusive to level 3, but not at the expense of ranged missile damage which is what's most important, besides point defense which is most important of all).
I haven't tested bombs vs level 3 bases yet.
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t500
Admiral
Fatal Squadron
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ugto level 3 base has a PCANNON
icc level 3 base has a railgun
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MrSparkle
Cadet
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Pcannon and railgun for level 3 bases huh? They have a lot more range than torpedoes, but unless they're very high level they aren't gonna do any damage.
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Shigernafy
Admiral
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Just have the level match the technology level... one volley of a Level 90 cannon could do some damage...
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-Sensitivity- [R33]
Cadet
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what happened to the "one hit" problem
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luna nobis providet
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2009-03-27 19:45
Odd that it shows me as a cadet in beta, but yeah I tested the tweaked Kluth defense bases and there's really no difference. More missiles are fired from level 2 defense bases and that's about it. I did not notice any damage increase whatsoever.
So defense bases suck now, and after the next patch they will still suck but at least level 2 defense bases will cause more lag!
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Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2009-03-27 22:17
Quote:
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On 2009-03-27 03:06, DarkScorpion wrote:
Planet defences....
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What?! What planet defenses. I haven't seen any of those.
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Leonide
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: October 01, 2005
Posts: 1553
From: Newport News, Virginia
| Posted: 2009-03-27 22:28
yeah, planet defenses need to be at .483 levels, where getting into range of a planet's defenses in a dread was considered suicide. 
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DarkScorpion
Marshal
Sanity Assassins
Joined: September 14, 2004
Posts: 237
From: London England
| Posted: 2009-03-28 00:23
Well i think what we dont want is more missiles just the amount a planet fires at the moment is enough for me, ie failed bombing run means your most likely dead unless you had plenty of support , i thought we had all decided we didnt want to see the return of the lone bomber and you said you have made planets harder to cap, no you just made it more easy no real risk of death.
Keep the way we have to bomb now with not watch my one bomb pwn this planet, still have the way you actualy need to target what you want to hit but make beams really powerful so as i cant just fly around planet picking inf/stuctures as i please.
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Sixkiller
Marshal
Courageous Elite Commandos
Joined: May 11, 2005
Posts: 1786
From: Netherlands
| Posted: 2009-03-28 12:04
Quote:
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On 2009-03-27 19:45, MrSparkle wrote:
Odd that it shows me as a cadet in beta, but yeah I tested the tweaked Kluth defense bases and there's really no difference. More missiles are fired from level 2 defense bases and that's about it. I did not notice any damage increase whatsoever.
So defense bases suck now, and after the next patch they will still suck but at least level 2 defense bases will cause more lag!
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transport your profile to beta, should be a link for that on the beta site
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AtomicChuck
Admiral
Joined: February 02, 2003
Posts: 10
From: KS, US Central Time Zone, GMT-5
| Posted: 2009-03-28 12:09
It seems to me that the primary factor that planetary defenses appear to be so weak now is due to the fact that dictors are not in operation. The planets have no real zone for their weapons to chip away as you approach. Hence, tranny rushes are more effective because you don't have to run the gauntlet that you previously had to in other versions with functioning dictors.
I propose that until dictors are again functional, we wait and see how they will fit into the mix with planetary defenses. After all, we don't want to boost defenses so much that you can only cap a planet with a functional dictor with a fleet of 10+ ships to counter the defense bases. Maybe when we have respectable player numbers again, yes... capping planets will need to be more difficult. But for now, until all of the pieces of the puzzle are in place, IMHO, def. bases should be left alone.
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2009-03-28 15:37
Quote:
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On 2009-03-28 12:04, Sixkiller wrote:
transport your profile to beta, should be a link for that on the beta site
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I did a while ago, that's how I can test things there. But it doesn't show on the forum.
And no, defense bases are not weak because of a lack of dictors. They're weak because they do no damage and pose no threat. Tranny rushing is one tiny piece of the puzzle; the truth is nobody is afraid of planet defenses.
Planets should not just be a threat at beam range. They should be a long-distance threat with very powerful missiles that are above station level. An enemy ship, no matter it's size, should want to stay clear of a fully-built level 3 enemy planet.
We tend to lose perspective in game on just how strong a planet should be, but the reality is that it's a planet. It's absolutely massive compared to the size of our ships and level 3 defense bases should be able to launch weapons more powerful than any ship we can fly due to sheer size alone.
I'm not saying level 3 planets should be death stars. I'm saying level 1 planets should be roughly what level 3 planets are right now (which isn't much). Level 2 planets should have roughly the offensive power of a dread, and level 3 planets should be stronger than a station, meaning it's missiles should hurt and should pose a threat.
Isn't the problem the fact that planets have level 0 weapons? That planet weapons cannot scale the way ship weapons can? I'm wondering if planets need their own unique weapons instead of using the same ones that ships use. But that requires more work from a volunteer dev team so I know it won't happen (that's not sarcasm please don't read it as such).
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Code Red
Chief Marshal
Non Omnis Moriar
Joined: September 08, 2007
Posts: 184
| Posted: 2009-03-29 08:23
I have to agree that planet defs are no longer a real threat as they should be , I remember in earlier versions getting hit by level3 def beams and watching my ship explode , which is nearer as it should be its a planet with huge power resourse and no restriction on size of weapon mountings etc , a planet with level3 defs should be feared and should not be capped by tranny rushing imho.
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DocZ
Cadet
Joined: April 09, 2002
Posts: 1
From: Austria(NÖ)
| Posted: 2009-03-31 07:14
After reading all of this, can someone explain why is it a must to cap a planet? They only have SY, thats the only reason. Maybe anyone have a idea how to make Caping of planets reasonable again like it was. (few years ago, when you needed the resources to build things, i.e. Darkmatter)
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DarkScorpion
Marshal
Sanity Assassins
Joined: September 14, 2004
Posts: 237
From: London England
| Posted: 2009-03-31 10:03
Quote:
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On 2009-04-01 08:25, xTx wrote:
i stopped playing because of the weak planetary defences. It should be a MAJOR event for a faction to lose a planet to the enemy. The way it is now, one player can capture all the planets in an extractor which has taken all the fun out of the game.
The planetary defences in 483 were actualy strong enough to defend the planet but bombs did too much damage, now that bombs do the proper amount of damage, making a planets defence as strong as it was in 483 is what this game needs now.
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Anyways we just want stronger planet beams i am glad we dont have planets spouting fighters any more as they have been improved lots
and probly just add to lag
[ This Message was edited by: DarkScorpion on 2009-04-03 01:11 ]
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