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The ICC noobs point of view. |
Mr_Morton
1st Rear Admiral
Joined: June 15, 2009
Posts: 30
|  Posted: 2009-11-03 18:20
I am kinda new to the game so I have tried out all the factions and i have some ideas on anti kluth tactics...
first- when the kluth is cloaked dont fly in a fkin straight line...when I play kluth i find it very easy alpha people in the back because no one seems to realize that flying in a straight line is bad...
second: use a light frig or somthing like that so you can beat those nasty beak frigs that are so overpowered. One nice thing about kluth is that you can outrun every ship in and above u class... so use a ship below the class what you are facing so you can get out of range of those evil disruptors. Once your away from the lasers it seems that is is pretty easy to dodge the cannons and pulse any missles coming in.
Third: always run away from the kluth ships, if the kluth ship is chasing you it will be flying at full speed and wont cloak because they are trying to conserve energy. they also will be at a range disadvantage from the icc rail guns which are, from what ive seen, harder to dodge than the kluth guns.
lastly: missles are kluth killers, so use them. if the kluth ship is chasing you they will be lined up perfectly for a missle to the nose if you quickly turn around fire off the missles and then keep running, or even better, some ships can fire missles from their backs. The disruptors are bad against missles because they are energy hungry and they fire slowly so you can always get a couple of hits with every volley. Also if they are chasing you they wont cloak because they will lose energy and to kluth energy is precious.
Now for you people who dont believe me I have personally beaten many kluth ships this way (ok only 5 but hey I just joined) and this works!!!!
Also kluth is my favorite and the only times Im killed is because of these very tactics (that and running into planets...).
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CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light
Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
| Posted: 2009-11-03 18:27
again lets not regress this to the kluth suck post....
i dont mind em.. like i said i need someone to hate.. every game has the hated faction.
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Zero28
Grand Admiral
Joined: August 25, 2006
Posts: 591
| Posted: 2009-11-03 18:31
Most Kluth Player Cloak way before chasing, There not in a rush,they take there time. i never seen any Kluth chase another player uncloaked, Im even starting to wonder if you where fighting VS Ai rather than player
Straight line don't matter , laser gets you anyway, except if you far, but that simply wont happen with kluth
Keeping range will cause them to cloak, perriod
think with missles, if you turn to fire, they so they will, and i harldy beleive a player Kluth will stay uncloaked knowing that you can gain range when he can't closes up, and even less if you got missles
The worse thing is when your reppairing, they can be simpyl 5 aroudn you and you don't even know, unlees you spend your entire game time spaming the ECCM button,...ECCM should always work with every pulses on its own, not by turning them on and off
i do not say Kluth sucks, it is a way to fight some people like and dislike, but it currently has too many advantages
[ This Message was edited by: Zero28 on 2009-11-03 18:33 ]
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RageMastaFlex
Fleet Admiral
Joined: August 16, 2006
Posts: 11
From: Sandy Oregon.
| Posted: 2009-11-03 19:07
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On 2009-11-02 18:42, MrSparkle wrote:
You can't beat the Kluth without teamwork, which means a variety of ships working together (I will not say which since I'm Kluth). 1 on 1 you aren't going to beat them because they can just choose not to die, and if you stick around trying to 1v1 them when they're cloaking and constantly getting into a better firing position, you're being played the fool. Just jump away.
ICC have a harder time vs Kluth than UGTO, for various reasons not including the fact that ICC ships feel generally underpowered (except the combat destroyer). There's specific reasons UGTO do better vs Kluth than ICC.
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I disagree there... yes in terms of Killing UGTO do better... In terms of Living. ICC do better. One thing Kluth do best is cloaking and getting right on your rear bumper, uncloaking, alpha, cloak. Its horrible... but one thing ugto has is the shield rotation. It helps... alot. (although shields need to be beef'd)
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The Fridge
Chief Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: December 13, 2008
Posts: 559
From: In Your Fridge, Eating your Foods.
| Posted: 2009-11-04 09:17
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On 2009-11-03 19:07, XRate wrote:
I disagree there... yes in terms of Killing UGTO do better... In terms of Living. ICC do better. One thing Kluth do best is cloaking and getting right on your rear bumper, uncloaking, alpha, cloak. Its horrible... but one thing ugto has is the shield rotation. It helps... alot. (although shields need to be beef'd)
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Living gets you no gain in Prestige, it helps to not lose the pres but if you ain't got the damage to deal out while your there your just a moving target gaining no prestige but not losing it either.
Kluth get the most Bang for there Buck, They do monster damage for the energy cost, then UGTO then ICC.
Defence wise it's ICC with UGTO soo close behind and then Kluth.
The ability to stay in battle goes like this UGTO, ICC with Kluth close behind.
ICC Excell in nothing but being able to be hit the most and combat wise are the worst fraction.
If you want to get quick easy Combat Pres you go Kluth.
If you want to stay in battle and do modest damage and also get lots of Repair points you go UGTO.
But with ICC You have the best defense and so last longest against fire - BUT the weapon caps reduce the time in battle we can stay for meaning were forced to leave battle not because were busted up (Usually are tho) but have run out of ammo for rails and Ions (Which disappear stupidly fast).
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2009-11-04 12:25
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On 2009-11-03 19:07, XRate wrote:
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I disagree there... yes in terms of Killing UGTO do better... In terms of Living. ICC do better. One thing Kluth do best is cloaking and getting right on your rear bumper, uncloaking, alpha, cloak. Its horrible... but one thing ugto has is the shield rotation. It helps... alot. (although shields need to be beef'd)
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I'm not telling you all the reasons why UGTO do better vs Kluth than ICC, but I will say that ICC are easier to hull.
ICC do not survive better vs UGTO, in 1v1 or 2v2 situations (fleets are another matter). Their shields right now do not protect them nearly as well as UGTO's reflective. Pair that with UGTO using tons of depots, supply plats and supply ships (which ICC do not get the same benefit from) and you'll see why ICC are the easier target for Kluth.
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CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light
Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
| Posted: 2009-11-04 12:49
again this is not a icc sucks kluth sucks ugto sucks.. kinda post.
its just to get the first impressions of noobs up and out there so the vets know why they might not be doing the pvp action
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Bardiche
Chief Marshal
Joined: November 16, 2006
Posts: 1247
| Posted: 2009-11-04 12:51
UGTO do indeed have superior defensive options as they can tailor their armour around what adversary they are fighting. The devlog says however that shields get an innate 25% protection against energy weapons, which I presume beams to fall under.
This should make ICC better equipped to fighting the K'Luth, but still not stellar because they are better at dealing damage over an extended period of time, whereas UGTO does gradual damage and K'Luth is damage in short bursts. The compatibility of ICC and K'Luth is simply not wonderful, although an easy strategy would be to go in teams of a few cruisers/destroyers, and then focus on one target at a time.
Newcomers are best off flying UGTO regardless, though, as both K'Luth and ICC require a vastly different approach and require a certain degree of skill and good judgement to be flown at a satisfying level, whereas UGTO is moreso designed around "jump in and fight" strategies. That is, you need to do the basic things that apply for all factions, but your strategy can boil down to "jump in and mash spacebar" and your chances of victory would be miles above K'Luth or ICC under the same train of thought.
This sort of novice feedback is rather important, I feel, so by all means any new players who want to lend their opinion on the state of each faction as current should pitch in and let everyone know. Well, that's my opinion as a simple member anyway.
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Iwancoppa
Fleet Admiral
Joined: November 15, 2008
Posts: 709
| Posted: 2009-11-04 13:58
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On 2009-11-02 19:32, ADmiraLMaXimus (Bringer of Doom) wrote:
Those who fear the kluth need to look deep inside and realize it’s not the cloak or the ahr that makes us seem overpowered....
It’s the fact that we mostly work in groups as a team and hit 1 target all at once...
we have weak armor and no sheilds ... nor can we change our armor in order to specifically fight any certain faction like (UGTO)... we also cant rotate shields to help us in combat like (ICC)
So instead we have ahr to help fix our hull and cloak to stay out of sight while we repair to fight again or in most cases it’s just to get out alive 
Also if you joined as a kluth player just to see how it is and still try to use tactics you have acquired playing as ICC or UGTO
:NOTE: it’s totally different
to truly see what it is to play as kluth you must stay on for a while develop team play skills and stealth strategies and above all else you must lean to become a hit and run player... as much as everyone will say you are a coward or call you names about running away.... im afraid that is the way you must play as kluth...
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You must have the patience to wait for the opportune moment to strike no matter how long it takes and even then must be prepared to leave the battle without even hulling your opponent as a team player expect to leave the kill to the next player....
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If you can’t do the above then you will never truly know what it is to be a kluth player.
Good luck to all
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no...
it takes no skill to be k'luth. i mean, i think they should lose AHR or cloak.
i can beat a BD in a scale, from side-on.....
k'luth cloak shouldnt work if the base sig of their ship is over 60.
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Fatal Forever
1st Rear Admiral
Joined: February 28, 2006
Posts: 26
From: Stockton, California
| Posted: 2009-11-04 14:46
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On 2009-11-04 13:58, iwanii the actor Gaifen wrote:
no...
it takes no skill to be k'luth. i mean, i think they should lose AHR or cloak.
i can beat a BD in a scale, from side-on.....
k'luth cloak shouldnt work if the base sig of their ship is over 60.
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I disagree K'luth need cloak and AHR in order to compete and stay alive vs ICC and Uggies. Of course you can beat a BD in a scale.. your ship obviously has more manueverability and a lower turn radius.
I've got plenty of experience fight both as and against K'luthies and I must admit it does take a certain playstyle and skill to fight as a K'luthie as it does to fight one. Sure they have certain advantages against us ICC and UGTO but that also means they have disadvantages. You guys have got to play smart. Exploit those disadvantages and you will be successful.
This is for some of the newer players to ICC and UGTO; did you know you can manually target and fire at any point in space around your ship? CTRL + Right click if i'm not mistaken. Practice doing this against a cloaked friend or enemy and if you can learn to master hitting your targets while they are cloacked or ECM'd. This will vastly increase your survivability and combat efficiency against K'luth.
Also, Detonate your torpedos near a cloaked K'luth.. trust me.. it hurts. Shift + Space bar for that.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2010-05-16 13:00
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On 2009-11-03 18:31, Zero28 wrote:ECCM should always work with every pulses on its own, not by turning them on and off
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As an ICC player this is the ONLY thing that bugs the !!&&~#%^ out of me when fighting Kluth. I can use ECCM and it reveals them for a split second, sometimes not even enough time to target them and fire, and then they're back to being cloaked and I have to wait for my ECCM to recharge before I can reveal them again. Other than this I generally have no trouble fighting off most Kluth players I've come across in scenario but I still usually jump away simply because it's a PITA getting one down to 25% or less hull and having them cloak and disappear, leaving me low on ammo with nothing to show for it. At least I can follow the UGTO ships when they jump away if I choose to do so.
Granted if I'm fighting and not building I'm usually flying a Sensor Corvette and can outrun/outmaneuver pretty much anything, but the same thing about ECCM could be said for any ship that has it.
And yes I realize it's can be different in MV, and not just because of enhancements.
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On 2009-11-04 14:46, Fatal Forever wrote:
This is for some of the newer players to ICC and UGTO; did you know you can manually target and fire at any point in space around your ship? CTRL + Right click if i'm not mistaken. Practice doing this against a cloaked friend or enemy and if you can learn to master hitting your targets while they are cloacked or ECM'd. This will vastly increase your survivability and combat efficiency against K'luth.
Also, Detonate your torpedos near a cloaked K'luth.. trust me.. it hurts. Shift + Space bar for that.
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Ctrl+left click, but this is good advice, and I've been practicing it on the rare occasion I'm flying something larger than a Corvette and not focusing on maneuvering. It's hard to get used to but I'm sure it's annoying or even discouraging to Kluth players when they realize they're getting hit even while cloaked. Another thing I've found effective when facing a Kluth who's in a smaller ship (or sometimes even the same size if it's Frigates) as yours is.....stop moving. Sit in one spot and just rotate your ship randomly, they're going to be flying rings around you anyway and this makes it harder for them to keep targeting one arc and usually lets you fire more of your weapons at them once they do decloak to fire.
I do not recommend this when you're outnumbered however, this is most effective as a 1v1 tactic.
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Lark of Serenity
Grand Admiral
Raven Warriors
Joined: June 02, 2002
Posts: 2516
| Posted: 2010-05-16 13:37
team work
team work
team work
bring a dictor, have a ship dedicated to ECCM pinging, dont all face the same way, cover one anothers weak points, fight on your terms instead of the enemy's, concentrate fire, etc. etc. etc.
k'luth have the advantage in positioning and quick redeployment because of the cloak and automated repair. they should try to lure you, bait you, sneak up behind you, ambush you. they are disadvantaged by weak armour, which means focused fire will easily overcome them. they also rely on being able to quickly escape to survive, so dictor them, beacon them, etc. they also have a critical disadvantage in that most of their ships are only effective when firing forward. an enemy fleet that deploys light ships to tail kluth vessels, and remains mobile to reduce the likelihood of an ambush, will inevitably get the better of the kluth.
ICC have the advantage in durability and range. they should try to reveal you at range, focus combat around planetary bodies since they are better at capturing and holding planets than the other factions. their disadvantage is firepower, which they should make up for by using an interdictor to keep the enemy in the fight longer than they want, and by trying to create situations where the enemy has to close to firing range while they can return fire. some ICC fleets will space themselves widely as well, so that their range advantage exists even if they are taken unawares.
UGTO have the advantage in disruption. they have a plethora of weapons that affect ship subsystems, rendering an enemy vessel useless without necessarily destroying it or even damaging it. EMP, flux, etc. with medium damaging weapons this means they can immobilize your ship and then take their time destroying it. the QST also makes it easy for UGTO to flush out a defended position through area of affect damage. their disadvantage is their immobility. they are slow and have a poor turning radius, meaning it is easy to focus fire on a single point of their armour.
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Fallen |3lood Angel*Kiyoh*
Vice Admiral
Joined: November 29, 2009
Posts: 47
From: Lagrange 4
| Posted: 2010-05-16 13:54
Third: always run away from the kluth ships, if the kluth ship is chasing you it will be flying at full speed and wont cloak because they are trying to conserve energy. they also will be at a range disadvantage from the icc rail guns which are, from what ive seen, harder to dodge than the kluth guns.
lastly: missles are kluth killers, so use them. if the kluth ship is chasing you they will be lined up perfectly for a missle to the nose if you quickly turn around fire off the missles and then keep running, or even better, some ships can fire missles from their backs. The disruptors are bad against missles because they are energy hungry and they fire slowly so you can always get a couple of hits with every volley. Also if they are chasing you they wont cloak because they will lose energy and to kluth energy is precious.
firstly, i'll cloak while going full speed it makes it easier to get to you, people have no sense, theyll turn around to try and find you, then you decloak and mash the spacebar before recloaking.
and secondly, missiles are horrible against kluth, the missiles will self destruct when the target they are after cloaks
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Necrotic
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: March 19, 2002
Posts: 378
| Posted: 2010-05-16 15:01
its good to see people who understand kluth tactics and not just omg omg omg kluth is op. anyone can play any faction but it takes real skill to play any o fthe factions well this includes kluth. Some people mentioned kluth in 1v1 situations kluth will never go into 1v1 unless its a garenteed kill. Kluth neither have the armor nor energy to survive a long fight. The AHR is no advantage how about you go sit for hour so your ahr can fix your dread hull. The cloak is only as good as the person using it. IT is far from an advantage it is compensation for no defense. people sometimes say kluth have no skill at all. of course they forget this when one of us is icc or ugto and we are owning everyone. When it comes down to it kluth is a playstyle. people just get mad that they cant 1v1 kluth in a team game like this. People cal names and say this or that is honorable when this is a war. Here is the coldest fact about kluth and why we win. ugto and icc care about gaining pres and living. When kluth all we care about is killing you even if it means the cost of our selves.think about that for awhile.
if u really wanna fight kluth then you have to understand them. you need to lessen their advantages while increasing your own. The kluth have disadvantages that can be exploited. icc recently have been doing well by deploying cruiser packs with dictors and scouts. think of this as anti submarine warfare. you wont see a destroyer fighting a submarine solo ever. kluth only have a forward arc. kluth have no armor. Kluth dont have enough energy for a sustained combat. the best thing you can do is play kluth for awhile learn their ships and tactics so u can be better off in your own faction.
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Lrd_Hunter
Grand Admiral
Joined: August 16, 2006
Posts: 245
| Posted: 2010-05-16 15:19
ok going to get in trouble for this for revileing a tactic. But for the noobs here you go don't spam your eccm. Here the thing yes you ping bam it shows ups then were gone but what you don't get with it on the sig goes up and guess what luth have to wait for there sig to get to what ever it is say 70 once the luth ships reachs 70 then it able to shot jump or cloak again but during that time it can only wait so don't turn of your eccm don't ping it over and over. another thing someone said it earlier energy it precious to luth (even with hot keys i have to be careful) shotting my disruptors, they drain energy faster then an icc rotate there shields. Here the thing for one v one. When a luth is cloaking it to line up for another attack or saving energy or both so this is the time to ping the bug so you can still shot them. Once there cloaked go as fast as you can with out using your energy and just keep going straight cause while we are cloaked when trying to get as fast as icc or ugto it drains energy but while cloaked it drains faster so use that time to get away and not to mention if they want to try and do a quick hit they have to wait for there sig to catch up. And by the time that has happened you have already got enough distance away (and the faster you go the higher your sig) you able to get out of range plus get a couple of hits in before they cloak again just some helpful tips there.
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