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Core Weapons |
Lonectzn
Fleet Admiral
Joined: January 06, 2005
Posts: 202
|  Posted: 2010-05-13 01:47
Are still too good.
I know they've gone through a couple nerfs, but that has been changed by the sheer number of them that go around and the enhancements available. Look at the krill - with range enhancements it becomes a cloaking long range sniper far outperforming missiles. And in general they really don't have any disadvantages over torps.
Ideally I would drop their speed massively. I'm talking slower than AM torpedoes. This would not change their use against large slow ships, by render them useless against anything small and quick, even at close range. It just makes no sense to have these things own everything.
I should say I'm biased, I always thought they were a terrible idea that basically became a cheap and lazy catch-all weapon. I'd still like to be rid of them altogether.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2010-05-13 02:01
Have you ever been shot at by the Ion Cannon?
The SI is fine. The projectile speed isn't excessive, nowhere as fast as the PSI or PC.
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Lonectzn
Fleet Admiral
Joined: January 06, 2005
Posts: 202
| Posted: 2010-05-13 02:07
People use torps which go much slower and far lower range, while also doing less damage. The speed is excessive in that they are over-effective against too wide a range of targets. They are too flexible with too few drawbacks.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2010-05-13 02:13
Quote:
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On 2010-05-13 02:07, Lonectzn wrote:
People use torps which go much slower and far lower range, while also doing less damage. The speed is excessive in that they are over-effective against too wide a range of targets. They are too flexible with too few drawbacks.
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U talking specifically about the SI, or about all core weaps in general?
Cos the IC moves pretty fast. And the QSTs cover distance pretty quickly too.
[ This Message was edited by: Kenny_Naboo on 2010-05-13 02:14 ]
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Lonectzn
Fleet Admiral
Joined: January 06, 2005
Posts: 202
| Posted: 2010-05-13 03:00
All the core weapons, the Krill was just an example because it has so many and is so often fitted all range enhancements 
[ This Message was edited by: Lonectzn on 2010-05-13 03:02 ]
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Aradrox
Grand Admiral
Joined: March 12, 2007
Posts: 133
From: Tennessee
| Posted: 2010-05-13 03:16
your rank is commander dont complain about stuff that you cant use yet end of story
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Starcommander
Marshal
Joined: December 14, 2005
Posts: 579
From: In your base, stealing your cookies
| Posted: 2010-05-13 03:22
Quote:
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On 2010-05-13 03:16, Fleet Admiral Aranox wrote:
your rank is commander dont complain about stuff that you cant use yet end of story
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nuff said
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Dreadknight
Fleet Admiral
Joined: March 10, 2004
Posts: 39
From: Denmark
| Posted: 2010-05-13 03:22
Let them do alot of dmg, have a good range, but a little slower than torps, so they are good against platforms (make sense to me, if we need big ships for hv defended planet, with alot of PD), stations and slow moving/ energy saving dreads.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2010-05-13 03:26
Hmm... I always get drilled bad by core weaps when I attack a station or dread. They're deadly.
But then again the 2 biggest baddest classes should have big bad heavy weaps too. No point having big ships without the heavy artillery, if you know what I mean.
As for nerfing the projectile speeds, you may have something there. But generally speaking, projectile speeds shouldn't be as slow, or slower than torpedoes. That would be ridiculous, seriously. Torpedoes are a joke currently. They should travel twice as fast and due to their lack of tracking.
But perhaps if we tweak the core weaps speed ever so slightly down.... say 10% to 15% down, then perhaps smaller ships in groups may have a chance to weave in, in between enemy fire, and hit the dreads and stations more effectively.
This might help to bring about more interest in using groups of small ships to take down dreads and stations, rather than the dread on dread, station on station, spacebar mash-fest that we see so much of.
So I guess, slightly cutting the speed down of core weaps, you have a +1 from me.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2010-05-13 03:27
Quote:
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On 2010-05-13 03:16, Fleet Admiral Aranox wrote:
your rank is commander dont complain about stuff that you cant use yet end of story
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Don't be arrogant, FA.
He was a GA before he resetted his account a few days back.
[ This Message was edited by: Kenny_Naboo on 2010-05-13 03:30 ]
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Lonectzn
Fleet Admiral
Joined: January 06, 2005
Posts: 202
| Posted: 2010-05-13 03:39
Quote:
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On 2010-05-13 03:27, Kenny_Naboo wrote:
Quote:
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On 2010-05-13 03:16, Fleet Admiral Aranox wrote:
your rank is commander dont complain about stuff that you cant use yet end of story
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Don't be arrogant, FA.
He was a GA before he resetted his account a few days back.
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OK I brought that on myself, most people wouldn't know
I agree about torpedoes, and maybe the speed doesn't need to be down that far, just enough to give cruisers and lower good chances to avoid them. Right now they can do almost everything.
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Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2010-05-13 06:09
Quote:
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On 2010-05-13 01:47, Lonectzn wrote:
Look at the krill - with range enhancements it becomes a cloaking long range sniper far outperforming missiles. And in general they really don't have any disadvantages over torps.
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The SI on a Krill do not fire farther than missles. Ion and QST shoot farther, and QST has pwnzor splash damage.
Also, as far as I can tell most people put weapon multis on Krills. I have one with all coolers. Distance? What noob does that with a krill anyways?
[ This Message was edited by: Azreal on 2010-05-13 06:11 ]
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Lonectzn
Fleet Admiral
Joined: January 06, 2005
Posts: 202
| Posted: 2010-05-13 06:24
I said outperform, which is true. Massively higher damage, immune to pd, faster, no minimum range. Take out some plats in a few rounds from over 1k, snipe a sup then go use them in a close range fight.
Nothing else comes even close in versatility.
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Starcommander
Marshal
Joined: December 14, 2005
Posts: 579
From: In your base, stealing your cookies
| Posted: 2010-05-13 06:24
Core weps are made for massive damage, the SI has the 2nd fastest travel speed (maybe the fastest), proceeded only by the Ion Cannon which fires 2 shots. The IC has to have BOTH shots hit to do its full damage, which is slightly more then a QST (I don't know if that is accurate anymore). On paper before damage reduction and enh are applied the IC is the hardest hitting thing out there (I think only PCM's beat it out). Hard hitting the fast travel with long range, its the best thing ICC has. Even then its hard to hit a cruiser over 200gu with one, and the smaller the ship the harder it gets. Even dreads can doge it if they turn soon enough and are far enough away. If the IC has issues like that, then anything else below it should be child's play. Only 2 classes of ship hold core weps and even then only half of one of them has even just 1. UGTO in fact gets a core wep at VA, where as both ICC and K'luth need to wait untill Admiral to even try shooting one. I was vary excited to reach Admiral to be able to get a combat dread and the first 2 ion cannons. Then came FA with my first station and the assault dread with 3 ion cannons. GA gave way to the Line Station, 5 IC that fired a vary long ways (was before the stupid range nerf). Vary few ships have core weps as it stands and there balanced well enough now that there perfectly fine.
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Lonectzn
Fleet Admiral
Joined: January 06, 2005
Posts: 202
| Posted: 2010-05-13 07:09
Of course, the ships that have core weapons are also among the most popular ships. But that is irrelevant anyway. So is what rank you get it at.
The point I'm making, is that the core weapons excel in just about any situation, and have no significant drawbacks or weaknesses. You say they are made for high damage, and I agree. I'm not saying that should change. I'm just saying there's no reason that as well as having the highest damage they should also move fast and be effective against almost anything
All a reduction in speed would do is increase the vulnerability of dreads and stations to smaller class ships, and put this unusually effective weapon into a more focused role. Given the extreme current bias towards large ships I expected this might be welcomed as a move in the right direction.
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