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[Suggestion] plats |
Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
|  Posted: 2010-09-23 13:37
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On 2010-09-22 20:33, Azreal wrote:
nothing can prevent pinging. Cloak times can be greatly extended due to the eccm that is carried on ships, and it is true that this can be somewhat countered by luth ecm on ships. However, there are no points for a luth riding scout and using ecm , and even if he did, all he effects is cloak/uncloak time.
That is all that adding ecm plats would do for us. It would basically allow us to find some very limited area to try to turn the battlefield favorable for us.
Is that wrong?
Then why have eccm plats, beacons, planetary sensors, and eccm fighters? Stop using them. They turn the battlefield in your favor. Wouldn't be right, right?
Simply limit the number. Let us have 'em please.
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You have cloak to turn the battlefield favorable to you, ECCM helps compensate for it. ICC/UGTO get nothing out of flying a Beacon/ECCM ship either (Scout stat is not used for anything) and all they do is affect cloak time since decloak is now static, unless they enjoy endlessly rotating a set of buttons constantly to ping. If beacons let people track ships that jump they'd be worth something and you'd see all 3 factions making use of them.
So basically Kluth have ways to counter our counter but don't want to use them because it means someone has to get out of a Dreadnought and fly a smaller ship? That's exactly what ICC/UGTO have to do to put those counters in place to begin with, unless you decide to attack ships near a planet with a sensor plat cluster (which happens all the time anyway), so how is it not fair?
I have to admit though, I'd be greatly amused by all the complaining that would result from ICC/UGTO making use of them to hide MDs and Stations while they ctrl click spam missiles/fighters at eachother.
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Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2010-09-23 13:39
Played Kluth in the last few weeks? Try it. Until then U have no opinion that matters to me or changes anything I said. The faction's ability to hit and run has been greatly nerfed. Period.
btw, a human player in a scout at least gets 1 pt per beacon landed. What does ecming get you?
funny, too, that you did not quote the very information that makes my point.
[ This Message was edited by: Azreal on 2010-09-23 23:21 ]
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2010-09-23 14:24
I have tried the cloak timer, infact. Granted scenario isn't exactly the same as MV but since I'm in a fleet I can't really hop over.
.....1 point per beacon that actually lands, yes. But again, the stat itself is not used for anything. Play one of the other factions for a few weeks and do nothing but beaconing then try saying 1 point is something. ECCM and pinging also gets nothing, yes we have groups but hey, so do you, so those ECM using Scouts on your side can join one to get pres. A Kluth Scout also has the advantage of being able to ECM while cloaked, being 100% free from death unless they're too close to a ship that blows up. Beaconing means you have to practically get into beam range to land it.
But we're getting off topic so I'll again say someone has to make the choice to attack another player sitting near a planet with sensor bases or a cluster of sensor platforms. It's not like someone can suddenly drop a platform cluster ontop of you, and they're immobile so they can't exactly chase you down. ECM platforms would be too easily abused to make DN/Station fleets undetectable.
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SpaceAdmiral
Grand Admiral
Joined: May 05, 2010
Posts: 1005
| Posted: 2010-09-23 21:47
Fleets undetectable untill you...
1. Track where the hail of projectiles is coming from, then point jump and manually target the moon sized objects
2. ECM yourself
3. Move away from the plats...
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2010-09-23 23:47
Quote:
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On 2010-09-23 14:24, Talien wrote:
ECM platforms would be too easily abused to make DN/Station fleets undetectable.
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Should we then remove sensor plats too? Since planets already have sensor bases? 
Or should we get into semantics and simply call these, anti-sensor plats? 
Besides, supp plats are already abused sometimes by command dreads towing them along as mobile buffers. Same goes for weap plats, but to a lesser extent, since they fire indiscriminately, sometimes hitting the towing ship.
[ This Message was edited by: Kenny_Naboo[+R] on 2010-09-23 23:48 ]
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NoBoDx
Grand Admiral
Joined: October 14, 2003
Posts: 784
From: Germany / NRW
| Posted: 2010-09-24 07:37
Quote:
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On 2010-09-23 13:37, Talien wrote:
... since decloak is now static...
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thats new to me
.. last time i played (4 or 5 days ago) it the decloak-time was still affected by present eccm
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2010-09-24 11:33
Quote:
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On 2010-09-24 07:37, NoBoDx wrote:
Quote:
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On 2010-09-23 13:37, Talien wrote:
... since decloak is now static...
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thats new to me
.. last time i played (4 or 5 days ago) it the decloak-time was still affected by present eccm
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Yup
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Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2010-09-24 12:08
lol. wow, proof is in his own words, he doesnt comprehend what I was saying lol.
Yeah, also the idea is that they are LIMITED IN NUMBER....meaning nobody can spam 30 ecm plats.....more like 5. I wouldnt think having more would be good.
And, like ANYTHING IN ANY GAME, people can find a way to exploit. However, we have /report and moderators for a reason.
And for the record, I'm crious who would use anti-sensor bases anymore. They literally have no purpose anymore. Unless you want your planet bombed that is. That means the only ecm is on ships, where as eccm is extremely abundant.
Am I the only one who really sees this as an issue? Being able to effectively nullify what our faction survives on?
And again, it only effects cloak times, not anything else, for us. Still doesn't prevent pinging and beacons, which are our "biggest" threat.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2010-09-24 12:25
Quote:
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On 2010-09-23 23:47, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
Should we then remove sensor plats too? Since planets already have sensor bases?
Or should we get into semantics and simply call these, anti-sensor plats?
Besides, supp plats are already abused sometimes by command dreads towing them along as mobile buffers. Same goes for weap plats, but to a lesser extent, since they fire indiscriminately, sometimes hitting the towing ship.
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Sensor plats are mostly useless anyway aside from preventing ECM bombing and being free pres for the luth who decide they want to blow them up after most people on the other side log off. Again, anyone who decides to attack people at a planet with sensor plat clusters clearly knows about it ahead of time and if they do it anyway they have no right to complain if they die because of it. They're a preventative measure, as long as they're around whoever built them generally doesn't get sneak attacked so nobody gains pres.
.....Yeah, I have to laugh on the very rare occasion I see someone towing a weapon plat, anyone with some sense will attack from the opposite side so the plat FFs whoever's towing it. Supply plats though, the only thing they're good for if you tow one around is ammo reload, a single supply plat takes forever to even repair a Scout. But if you're using ships that will need frequent reloads then chances are you've got a supply or SS along too so it's mostly redundant, I don't see how that could be considered abusing supply plats.
Quote:
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On 2010-09-23 21:47, SpaceAdmiral wrote:
Fleets undetectable untill you...
1. Track where the hail of projectiles is coming from, then point jump and manually target the moon sized objects
2. ECM yourself
3. Move away from the plats...
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1. I think the forced detection range for Stations under ECM is around 600 GU? You're well within IC/QST/cannon range at that point. Ctrl clicking the spot it's at would be more trouble than it's worth since you'd have to constantly update your force fire spot because of moving around to avoid getting shot. Granted the plats would cover you as well, so it would be annoying with everyone having to ctrl+click to target. And then the luth show up, kill someone, and are able to recloak almost instantly as soon as the timer wears off, which I suppose is what the thought behind the suggestion was.
2. Covered that already in the post you quoted.
3. Generally I'd bet they'd be used for attacking planets. Hard to move away from the plats when you're defending a planet, only thing you can do is kill them but that's also hard to do when they're ECMed and surrounded by a fleet.
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xMcVikingx
Vice Admiral
Joined: August 31, 2010
Posts: 5
| Posted: 2010-09-24 13:13
I would like to see a platform that carries fighters i.e. a fighter base. Maybe something along the lines of a 'seige platform' as well, one that can be towed and used to blockade a planet or gate with interdictor and a few fighters as well as planetary seige missiles. And unlikely it would be implemented but I think it would be cool if you could build a decoy platform that would create false ship signatures to confuse the enemy
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