| Author |
[Suggestion] The Overhaul Project (Incomplete) |
Thrie
Fleet Admiral
Raven Warriors
Joined: October 28, 2002
Posts: 760
|  Posted: 2011-09-28 18:00
Note: The suggestion is incomplete... nothing is final. This has been sitting on my desktop for a month
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After playing 1.67x for a moderate amount of time (mostly as ICC), it has inspired me to explore possible revision that could improve the gameplay of Darkspace. Here, I will be listing a torrent of proposals that I hope the Devs would take into consideration. I will also be listing suggestions proposed by other users of the Darkspace community that has seemed popular and should be given a closer examination.
I ask that all users who reply to this thread to give constructive feedback so that each topic could be discussed and potentially further improve the presented proposals. If you do decide to post an argument, include multiple perspectives to why you believe the point is not to your satisfaction and/or provide a better alternative.
The Overhaul Project [status: incomplete]
Table of contents:
1. AI
2. Weapons
3. Ship
4. Armor/Shield
5. Interdictor
6. Electronic Warfare
7. Planet
8. Infantry
9. Aux Gadgets
10. Beta Testing
[01: AI]
The mechanics of present AI is creating a negative player experience. There's a few ideas floating around posted by players who are unhappy about how AIs are currently being used.
Remove the ability for players to send commands to AI. Allow the AIs to follow their natural programming. Combat AIs will respond and jump to the aid of planets and players who has sent out a distress signal. This would also require the game to restrict the number of times a player can send out a distress call. Supply AI will only respond to repair command sent by players and Supply distress based on priority of ship classes. Transport AIs will only respond to commands to reinforce friendly planets if they are being invaded by enemy infantry.
Secondly, introduce more enemy ships deep in each faction's territory. Currently, Pirates are frequently seen in faction's home systems. I'd like to see a small number of AIs of the opposing faction's ship in those system performing an event ranging from raiding transport ships or bombing a specific planet (no capping).
Update: Waiting for the newer AI script.
|02.1: Weapons|
First off, I would like to suggest slashing a chunk of damage all across the chart. At least 15% for both ICC/UGTO and 10% for Kluth.
Now, UGTO should have a medium damage rate with their weapons, lasers and missiles. High damage rate with torps, fighters and core weapons. Large number of weapons and wide firing arcs. Medium reload time and medium energy dran.
ICC would have low damage rate for weapons, lasers and fighters. Medium damage rate for torps and core weapons. High damage rate for missiles. Fast weapon reload and light energy drain.
Kluth would have low damage rate with fighters and missiles. High damage rate for beams, torps, core weapons and weapons. Long reload time and heavy energy drain.
|02.2: Projectile spread|
I was wondering if this game can be sophisticated enough to include weapon accuracy? I'd like to be able to see projectiles spread outwards for Weapon and Hvy Weapons.
Update: Beam weapon's will be able to target random gadget on the targeted ship. So there's a method to create weapon projectile spread.
|02.3: Grouped weapon|
Condensing weapon slots of the same firing arc into a single slot. For example: 4 forward firing torps would be considered as one weapon slot. Can be scaled to ship class thus a destroyer with 1 forward firing weapon slot would launch 4 torps and a dread with 1 forward firing weapon slot would launch 9 torps.
|02.4: Faction based, role specific weapon gadgets|
UGTO:
ICC:
Kluth:
|03: Ship|
Currently, ship speed seems to be bland across all ship class and factions. I’d liked to introduce a few suggestion to increase tactical gameplay.
Faction Max Speed preference:
Kluth (uncloaked) > Icc > Ugto
Icc > Ugto> Kluth (Cloaked)
Speed reduction to cloaked Kluth where max speed of 20gu will be dropped down to 15gu (may go with percentage modification so that Dread will not be entirely nerfed whereas it would make a big difference with smaller ship class such as frigs and destroyers). Additionally, remove or drastically reduce the energy drain from cloak.
|03.2 Hit Box|
Revise the current circular hitbox into an oval. A circular hitbox is not ideal considering ships of Darkspace are mostly long and narrow with the exception of transports, scouts, frigates and stations.
|03.2 Ship Role|
Propose changing some of the ship layout to better fit a role specific enviroment.
Combat/Battle role: Usually the first ship you can get of that class. They possess moderate shield/armor and but a good number of mixed weapons best used for broadside firing.
Heavy role: Loaded with shield/armor, these ships are configured to be defensive. They are armed with a moderate amount of weapons that has wide firing arc.
Assault role: Ships configured with high amount of frontal firepower and shield/armor. However, lacking in side and rear armor.
Support role: Various support ships such as missile, dictor and bombers. They will have a balanced armor/shield all around the ship.
|04: Armor/Shield|
Armor strength should be relative on a ship. On ships other than Assault, side armor should have the highest HP as compared to front and rear.
Introduce Aft only armor. The rear of the ship should be the most vulnerable part of the ship and its armor should not have the same HP as side or front armor.
|05. Interdictor|
Currently there's no effective countermeasure against Kluth's cloak and flying a Dictor is not rewarding. Here's the idea.
ICC/UGTO Dictors: Additional to dictor field preventing enemy ships from jumping in/out, when Kluth ships enters within 500gu of the field, their cloak become distorted and has a chance to temporarily make cloaked Kluth ship to become transparent for a short moment. It does not completely take Kluth out of cloaking and it does not make the Kluth ship targetable. Manual firing will still be required. (considering reducing the range to 400gu)
Kluth Dictors: Don’t really have any idea since Kluth has claok advantage over human factions.
|06: Electonic Warfare|
Suggestion deemed unfeasable.
|07: Planet|
|08: Infantry|
Have 3 types of role specific infantry that would make a difference in capturing/defending a planet.
Tier 1 Light Infantry: First type of infantry a newly constructed Barrack can build. They are fast to train (2:00min) and capable of moving across the planet quickly. However, they do not posses any high offensive or defensive capability. They are the backbone of any developing planet. Light Infantry has the ability to switch into evasive mode. While in the evasive mode, Light Infantry will attempt to avoid enemy infantry.
Tier 2 Garrison Infantry: When the planet’s infrastructure and technology has made enough advancement, the Garrison infantry becomes available. These infantry require a higher training time(4:00min) to become effective in defending a planet against the enemy invasion force. They are highly resistant against enemy bombing and have the option to go into patrol stance. During patrol stance, Garrison Infantry will randomly move across the planet’s service making themselves a harder target to enemy bombers.
Tier 3 Assault Infantry: Once the planet has reached the height of its civilization, Assault Infantry becomes available from the Barrack. Of all the infantry, Assault Infantry takes the longest to train (8:00min). The reason for their long training time is their high offensive capability, which makes them an excellent offensive infantry. They are best trained on planets far from the frontline because their defensive rating makes them vulnerable even to Planetary Siege Missiles and Light Infantry.
|09: Aux gadgets|
|10: Beta Testing|
[ This Message was edited by: Thrie on 2011-09-28 18:35 ]
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[Fleet Admiral] Thrie \"The Tiger\" Barton of [C.S.S. Armor Tiger]
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Thrie
Fleet Admiral
Raven Warriors
Joined: October 28, 2002
Posts: 760
| Posted: 2011-09-28 18:00
Reserved
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[Fleet Admiral] Thrie \"The Tiger\" Barton of [C.S.S. Armor Tiger]
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jimjimjaroo
Grand Admiral
Joined: March 06, 2009
Posts: 308
From: Michigan, USA
| Posted: 2011-09-28 18:21
no i didnt read it all but so far(out of what i've read) sounds good. but theres one flaw, the server wont be able to process all of this.
[ This Message was edited by: jimjim578 on 2011-09-28 18:24 ]
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Pantheon
Marshal
Palestar
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1789
| Posted: 2011-09-28 18:26
All of this is already in the game, except for the AI, which Faustus is working on now, other than...
ECM/ECCM : not feasable.
Dictor : nope.
Rear only armor: nope (already has weight as a con).
[ This Message was edited by: Pantheon on 2011-09-28 18:27 ]
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marco ramius
Admiral
Joined: October 16, 2010
Posts: 23
| Posted: 2011-09-28 19:05
adding numpad 5 = equalize shield power to all sides
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CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light
Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
| Posted: 2011-09-28 19:24
want to equal out your shields? assign them all to number 9 or 8 and push it. evenly distrubites power among shields assinged to that number
also there is a great deal about the game engine you dont understand.
1. Beams targeting individual gadgets is not a result of a projectile spreading stat.
2. Weapons are fired on a best case scenario solution. The game factors target position, range, direction, projectile speed, your bearing, and speed, and formulates a solution that will hit the target if he maintains his course. More accuracy on this best case scenario can only be achieved with slowing down ships, or speeding up projectiles, as neither man nor machine can predict the future.
[ This Message was edited by: *XO*Defiance{CM7} on 2011-09-28 19:40 ]
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Incinarator
Chief Marshal
Joined: May 24, 2010
Posts: 237
| Posted: 2011-09-28 23:39
Quote:
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On 2011-09-28 19:24, *XO*Defiance{CM7} wrote:
...
2. Weapons are fired on a best case scenario solution. The game factors target position, range, direction, projectile speed, your bearing, and speed, and formulates a solution that will hit the target if he maintains his course. More accuracy on this best case scenario can only be achieved with slowing down ships, or speeding up projectiles, as neither man nor machine can predict the future.
[ This Message was edited by: Incinarator |SoT| on 2011-09-28 23:49 ]
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Thrie is saying to introduce innacuracy to the system, not increase the accuracy already present.
Changing the hitbox to more accurately fit the contours of the ship has already been deemed unfeasable by the devs.
Grouped weapons are already accounted for by ship designs, which would have to be remade to accomodate this.
I'm not sure if the auxillary shield generator issue ever got fixed, so if it hasn't that would be a good thing.
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CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light
Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
| Posted: 2011-09-29 12:56
yep. Read that wrong. Sorry bro
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2011-09-29 13:13
Changing the hitboxes to hug the hull has been brought up a few times, and the general response from devs is it's not doable because it would change how the server handles hit detection and result in a massive load increase. A circle around each ship is less than ideal, but there really isn't any workable alternative.
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CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light
Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
| Posted: 2011-09-29 13:44
well.. there sortof is..
One giant circle to cover the entire ship (A), then several smaller ones to cover only where the ship is(1,2,3,4,5,6).
If projectile hits A, then and only then ask if projectile has hit 1,2,3,4,5, or 6.
Lots of games use this type of hit detection when individual areas of the model can be hit and damaged. It ensures that there is only one hitbox per ship being constantly asked if there has been a collision, but also gives complex, form fitting hitbox detection when needed.
The main problem with this is its already hard enough to hit ships. Imagine trying to fire at their small fore or aft face. And since individual areas of ships dont take individual damage, this doesnt really have a place.
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Defiance and Opposition, a tribute to teamwork. I will remember always
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µOmniVore
Grand Admiral
Joined: September 13, 2006
Posts: 171
| Posted: 2011-09-29 15:04
I Like some of these ideas, but I would rather Faustus Focus on a Modern dark space since this game is dated and every fix causes more problems than they solve.
Do not take this as a call to end this game i say focus 95% on a new Space Sim territory game while keeping dark space alive till the new game is finished. and Dark space 2 doesn't count since there is no official announcement concerning the game.
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Iwancoppa
Fleet Admiral
Joined: November 15, 2008
Posts: 709
| Posted: 2011-09-29 16:30
ship-hugging hitboxes would be unfiar,
some factions have very small, long and skinny
ships ( Read: Scale )
While other ships are fat (Read: Most icc junk)
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-09-29 21:40
Quote:
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On 2011-09-29 16:30, iwancoppa wrote:
ship-hugging hitboxes would be unfiar,
some factions have very small, long and skinny
ships ( Read: Scale )
While other ships are fat (Read: Most icc junk)
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Well, IQQ players love their ship designs, don't they?
So fat is sexy for IQQ'ers. I wonder if it extends to their women.... 
That being said, as much as most of us would like conformal hitboxes, Jack has mentioned that it would be costly in terms of server load and won't be implemented. Sad really. But that's the game engine's limitation. What can we do?
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Pantheon
Marshal
Palestar
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1789
| Posted: 2011-09-29 22:22
Quote:
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On 2011-09-29 21:40, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-09-29 16:30, iwancoppa wrote:
ship-hugging hitboxes would be unfiar,
some factions have very small, long and skinny
ships ( Read: Scale )
While other ships are fat (Read: Most icc junk)
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|
Well, IQQ players love their ship designs, don't they?
So fat is sexy for IQQ'ers. I wonder if it extends to their women....
That being said, as much as most of us would like conformal hitboxes, Jack has mentioned that it would be costly in terms of server load and won't be implemented. Sad really. But that's the game engine's limitation. What can we do?
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Nothing to do with the game engine - there's a reason all hitboxes in games are squares (and I really do mean all games). We use circles, and that's more costly than squares. It's not gonna happen unless someone invents some hardware that allows us to calculate the hull mesh each frame and calculate if a projectile on the same frame has collided with it.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-09-30 00:21
Quote:
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On 2011-09-29 22:22, Pantheon wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-09-29 21:40, Kenny_Naboo[+R] wrote:
Quote:
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On 2011-09-29 16:30, iwancoppa wrote:
ship-hugging hitboxes would be unfiar,
some factions have very small, long and skinny
ships ( Read: Scale )
While other ships are fat (Read: Most icc junk)
|
|
Well, IQQ players love their ship designs, don't they?
So fat is sexy for IQQ'ers. I wonder if it extends to their women....
That being said, as much as most of us would like conformal hitboxes, Jack has mentioned that it would be costly in terms of server load and won't be implemented. Sad really. But that's the game engine's limitation. What can we do?
|
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Nothing to do with the game engine - there's a reason all hitboxes in games are squares (and I really do mean all games). We use circles, and that's more costly than squares. It's not gonna happen unless someone invents some hardware that allows us to calculate the hull mesh each frame and calculate if a projectile on the same frame has collided with it.
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I tht you said that you calculated the ship's hitbox by measuring the distance from the center of the object, and that's why it's a circle.
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