| Author |
A challenge |
Fattierob
Vice Admiral
Joined: April 25, 2003
Posts: 4059
|  Posted: 2011-10-12 20:40
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-12 18:01, Talien wrote:
This isn't pokemon.....damage has no effect on capture rate, a ship with 0 damage is just as likely to be captured as a ship with 1% hull.
|
|
for some reason, I find this idea amusing
_________________
|
Demigan
Vice Admiral
Joined: September 12, 2011
Posts: 88
| Posted: 2011-10-13 16:57
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-12 18:01, Talien wrote:
This isn't pokemon.....damage has no effect on capture rate, a ship with 0 damage is just as likely to be captured as a ship with 1% hull.
|
|
I disagree, I have no proof of this other then experience (what are YOU using as proof of your words?), but I have a success rate of about 50% when I drop 3 or 4 veteran troops on a dread when it's below 50% hull, while I have had one capture, just one, on a dread with full hull, and I tried that numerous times, but stopped doing it as it was just a waste of infantry.
Yours sincerely,
Demigan.
_________________
|
Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2011-10-13 18:15
I'm going by what I've seen various staff members say.
_________________
Adapt or die.
|
Forger of Destiny
Chief Marshal
We Kick Arse
Joined: October 10, 2009
Posts: 826
| Posted: 2011-10-14 02:47
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-13 16:57, Demigan wrote:
but I have a success rate of about 50% when I drop 3 or 4 veteran troops on a dread when it's below 50% hull, while I have had one capture, just one, on a dread with full hull, and I tried that numerous times, but stopped doing it as it was just a waste of infantry.
|
|
hull % is really insignificant towards the probability of capture. some examples to show -
captured pirate stations using only 4 infantry in 1 cruiser drop. the station had some shield damage, everything else intact.
captured pirate stations using 18 infantry in 6 destroyer drops. the station had 60-80% hull damage, less than 40% armor and no shields.
captured mi stations using 3 inf in 1 destroyer drop, station had about 80% hull and 50% armor.
captured mi station at 100% hull and armor, using 90 inf in 9 transport drops.
captured hulled pirate destroyers and mi cruisers using 3 infantry, but failed to capture hulled pirate frigate using 6 inf in 2 drops.
now for some more weird things -
avoided being captured in my siphon 6 times in a row. each time i had less than 10% hull, was boarded by 4 veteran or hardened inf, was cloaked.
been captured in my hive station, 80% hull, 30% armor, by just 4 infantry.
captured a player using 4 inf, all veteran. enemy had 50% hull and 20% armor.
i have captured many supply ships with 2 veteran inf, but failed to capture an elite dread using 10 elite inf.
proof? i am a marshal, have been here for 2 years, have over 1700 (seventeen hundred) ingame hours of experience, and am a silver privateer. whats more, talien is even better than i am.
_________________
Forging legends and lives outside till naught remains inside.
|
Demigan
Vice Admiral
Joined: September 12, 2011
Posts: 88
| Posted: 2011-10-14 04:33
Normally I would say 'that's absolutely no statistical evidence, you are using just some random encounters'. But since I don't have them myself, I have nothing to say about that.
I'll just correct something I said earlier, I said that dropping infantry on a ship below 50% was key, but that only counts when you keep attacking said ship, and usually it is captured when you shoot it till it e-jumps (so below 5% hull or so) I've thrown infantry on numerous players, and only had captures when they were beat up like hell. But I've only had 2 player captures so far.
I would like to see more a statistical analysis of all ships capture rates and so on, I found something like that on a site, but that was of an old update (said something about an update that enabled capturing again), and I don't know if I'm allowed to post a link to the capture rates they displayed there. Nothing was said about damage there.
Yours sincerely,
Demigan.
_________________
|
Aaron Lienhardt
Fleet Admiral
Joined: December 18, 2009
Posts: 76
| Posted: 2011-10-14 06:38
i once found myself with a node and one of its escorts, if i remember correctly it was being ''attacked'' by that escort and they were both ignoring me,and the node didnt fire anything.
hmmmm
_________________
Yes!!! we got here before the damn luthies!! who wants to celebrate?
|
Forger of Destiny
Chief Marshal
We Kick Arse
Joined: October 10, 2009
Posts: 826
| Posted: 2011-10-14 06:40
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-14 04:33, Demigan wrote:
Normally I would say 'that's absolutely no statistical evidence, you are using just some random encounters'. |
|
why do you not believe me? i just told you about 30 of my 70 captures...
also ship capture is a chance thing. when times were good, i managed to capture 12 ships (engineers, extractors and frigate) with 4 inf and capture 2 kluth dreads (kaz'ora elite and ai mandible) with >2< inf each.
when times are bad, i spend my time continuously dropping inf on ships (like 90 inf on 1 mi node) and there are times when even persistence doesnt succeed (and i am talking about spending 30 minutes trying to capture mi longhead, then giving up and getting combat dread for fight).
as far as statistics are concerned, then the algorithm for boarding enemy is like this -
1) every infantry which boards enemy stays on ship for 1 minute
2) friendly inf has to fight enemy defending inf
3) if friendly inf survives enemy inf after 1 minute, then 100-face dice roll takes place for the first surviving friendly inf to board enemy
4a) if dice roll value (between 1-100) is below or equal to number assigned for inf's rank, ship is capped and made friendly
4b) if dice roll value is above number assigned to inf's rank, then inf dies
5a) if outcome 4a happens, kill all inf onboard ship
5b) if outcome 4b happens, roll dice again for next surviving friendly inf
basically, each living infantry has capture chance correspondent to its rank. so, veteran infantry > green heavy infantry
ill say it again ---> Hull integrity value and/or whether the target ship continuously taking damage does not affect the probability of capture, Demigna.
_________________
Forging legends and lives outside till naught remains inside.
|
buggy123
Fleet Admiral
Joined: December 22, 2009
Posts: 16
| Posted: 2011-10-14 09:18
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-14 06:40, Compromisery wrote:
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-14 04:33, Demigan wrote:
Normally I would say 'that's absolutely no statistical evidence, you are using just some random encounters'. |
|
why do you not believe me? i just told you about 30 of my 70 captures...
also ship capture is a chance thing. when times were good, i managed to capture 12 ships (engineers, extractors and frigate) with 4 inf and capture 2 kluth dreads (kaz'ora elite and ai mandible) with >2< inf each.
when times are bad, i spend my time continuously dropping inf on ships (like 90 inf on 1 mi node) and there are times when even persistence doesnt succeed (and i am talking about spending 30 minutes trying to capture mi longhead, then giving up and getting combat dread for fight).
as far as statistics are concerned, then the algorithm for boarding enemy is like this -
1) every infantry which boards enemy stays on ship for 1 minute
2) friendly inf has to fight enemy defending inf
3) if friendly inf survives enemy inf after 1 minute, then 100-face dice roll takes place for the first surviving friendly inf to board enemy
4a) if dice roll value (between 1-100) is below or equal to number assigned for inf's rank, ship is capped and made friendly
4b) if dice roll value is above number assigned to inf's rank, then inf dies
5a) if outcome 4a happens, kill all inf onboard ship
5b) if outcome 4b happens, roll dice again for next surviving friendly inf
basically, each living infantry has capture chance correspondent to its rank. so, veteran infantry > green heavy infantry
ill say it again ---> Hull integrity value and/or whether the target ship continuously taking damage does not affect the probability of capture, Demigna.
|
|
Whats the rank values of green/vet/hardened inf?
_________________
|
-(kha-ti the silent watcher)-
Grand Admiral
Joined: September 12, 2011
Posts: 185
From: the land of silent watchers
| Posted: 2011-10-14 10:43
ha ha i remember when the luth capped a longhead...what a glorious day that was for our enemies to see a kluth longhead comming towards them but anyway good luck with that those mi are hard
_________________
|
Fattierob
Vice Admiral
Joined: April 25, 2003
Posts: 4059
| Posted: 2011-10-14 22:33
Their seems to be a bit of mis-information about how capturing works.
Here's how it works (from what I can tell from the code)
All units have an experience value that is a floating point number from 0.0 to 1.0.
Elite units are > .9, Hardenered are >.5, vetern are >.25 and green is anything else. Having more experience makes your units do more damage to other infantry in ground combat as well
First off the capture roll is based off a 100 sided die, then that number is then subtracted by the units experience value multiplied by 10.
So, a unit that's just hit elite would subtract their 100 sided die roll by 9.
Then, enhancements kick in and increase the die roll. So say you rolled a 50, and you have a 10% ship capture defensive enhancement, the roll is increased to 55.
Then, this number is checked to see if it's lower or equal to the ships capture chance. I'm not going to give away what the numbers are, but anything larger then a scout is single digit.
If the ship isn't captured, the infantry damages a random subsystem.
The unit is then removed from the game.
So, an example for clarity:
Two Hardened inf are droped on a ship that has a 10% bonus to capture defense.
When they timer says so, the first inf makes it roll - let's say 30. 5 is subtracted (.5 *10) from that roll making it 25. the 10% enhancement kicks in, increasing it to 27 (integer value rounds off the extra).
27 is nowhere near any number to capture a ship, so the infantry destroys a random subsystem and dies.
Second inf rolls a 5. It's droped to 0 (.5 *10) and this infantry will capture any ship in the game and dies afterwards.
_________________
|
Tellaris
Grand Admiral
Galactic Navy
Joined: April 30, 2002
Posts: 830
From: Land of Chocolate
| Posted: 2011-10-15 00:41
All of MI space has been captured.
Nodes have been captured quite a bit.
Luthies are the only ones that can do this relatively easily (cloak)
Luthies have done both.
Good luck on doing it!
_________________
Captain of the StarCruiser
I hit planets for fun!
Spellchecker, the POWER t00l
|
Demigan
Vice Admiral
Joined: September 12, 2011
Posts: 88
| Posted: 2011-10-15 05:57
The reason why I not believed you (I do now, although I will try out capture rates with whole ships vs damaged ships before I will actually just drop infantry on any ship that comes by), is because I had a different experience when capturing ships. So you were saying counterproductive things about what I had experienced.
With most of the data on the table (thanks fattierob), however, I believe you, and I'll try it out to see if it actually works that way.
I don't care if all of MI space have been captured before, or that nodes have been captured before. I'm a new player, and this looks like a fun challenge to me, especially since I'll be using ICC myself, so no cloaking and a lot of danger. What's more, I understand that there are far less players online nowadays (most players I've seen on ICC at a time was 7, me included).
I intent to capture a node when the AI is responsive and attacks you, there is no challenge in a node that does not fire back. In that case it would become a sheer 'how many troops can I drop in the least amount of time'
Yours sincerely,
Demigan.
_________________
|
apate
Fleet Admiral
Joined: March 21, 2010
Posts: 205
| Posted: 2011-10-15 16:54
Surprised no one beat me to this..
_________________
|
Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-10-15 21:11
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-11 11:13, Demigan wrote:
So, yesterday I cranked up my ship captures to 10.7, so far nothing below a dread, most of them elite's, and 2 players.
Then I decided to try and capture an MI assembler, and see if they could do marvelous things for a planet. Reaching procyron, I had my first vision of a Node... 200 GU away from me.
Naturally, I tried to capture it.
It's torpedo's halved a shield arc perfectly (I was in an ICC combat destroyer), then I got too close and got toasted by beam that killed my all the way.
After returning there, I found out that friendly AI doesn't go through the portal, and the one AI that did, never reached the other side. The node was still there, now about a thousand GU from the gate, but it had 5 legion cruisers, one preatorian and a supply ship to help him.
Now, I really want to have a go at one of these things, but I would need help, or a solid tactic, but probably both. Anyone up for the challenge to try and capture one of THOSE?
Yours sincerely,
Demigna.
|
|
Wrong faction. Use a Kluth tranny and decloak on top of him.
Unload. E jump out.
_________________
... in space, no one can hear you scream.....
|
Demigan
Vice Admiral
Joined: September 12, 2011
Posts: 88
| Posted: 2011-10-17 13:29
Quote:
|
On 2011-10-15 16:54, Athenian General wrote:
Surprised no one beat me to this..
|
|
Thanks! When you are online, we should try and get some people warm there and then maybe.
As for Kenny Naboo:
I was asking for a challenge, not a cheap capture! I know that luth would be easier 
_________________
|
English
Deutsch
Nederlands
)
