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Flux Capacitor
Marshal
Joined: July 30, 2010
Posts: 305
From: the place
|  Posted: 2012-09-24 02:01
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On 2012-09-23 19:31, Fattierob wrote:
Here's the thing some people don't realize: We don't use a minimum distance, we use a minimum "time lived". Let's say the missile travels at 100 gu/s and we state that the minimum range on the missile is 200 gu. What that really means is that the missile has to be "alive" for 2 seconds (100 gu/s * 2) before it is considered "armed" and will deal damage. Think of it as if the missile has to travel 200 gu before being allowed to deal damage.
[ This Message was edited by: Fattierob on 2012-09-23 19:32 ]
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what happens if someone has 2 seconds desynch?
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Eledore Massis [R33]
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: May 26, 2002
Posts: 2694
From: tsohlacoLocalhost
| Posted: 2012-09-24 04:48
To note;
When a missile is Launched it starts counting its own life.
When it Reaches arm-time; it will do damage.
when it Reaches maxlife; (+ enhancements) it will destroy itself.
As said above we use those + the missiles speed to calculate max and minimum ranges.
But, what to you might look as 300gu from ship to ship, for a missile with its arcing trajectory will take more then a 300gu flight length.
So technically it is possible to get shot & damaged just under the known minimal ranges. As they don't take into account the missiles arcing trajectory.
That said, it should be mentioned that the reverse, at maximum range, you will never be able to damage anyone, due to these trajectories. They will blow up before they even can hit the target..
E.
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2012-09-24 05:32
Quote:
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On 2012-09-24 04:48, Eledore Massis [R33] wrote:
To note;
When a missile is Launched it starts counting its own life.
When it Reaches arm-time; it will do damage.
when it Reaches maxlife; (+ enhancements) it will destroy itself.
As said above we use those + the missiles speed to calculate max and minimum ranges.
But, what to you might look as 300gu from ship to ship, for a missile with its arcing trajectory will take more then a 300gu flight length.
So technically it is possible to get shot & damaged just under the known minimal ranges. As they don't take into account the missiles arcing trajectory.
That said, it should be mentioned that the reverse, at maximum range, you will never be able to damage anyone, due to these trajectories. They will blow up before they even can hit the target..
E.
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Good explanation.
That explains why Harpex missiles fired from stations (vertical launch) can hit you and do damage even under 350 gus. They arc up, and back down on your head.
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Pantheon
Marshal
Palestar
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1789
| Posted: 2012-09-24 07:58
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On 2012-09-24 02:01, -domedi- wrote:
Quote:
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On 2012-09-23 19:31, Fattierob wrote:
Here's the thing some people don't realize: We don't use a minimum distance, we use a minimum "time lived". Let's say the missile travels at 100 gu/s and we state that the minimum range on the missile is 200 gu. What that really means is that the missile has to be "alive" for 2 seconds (100 gu/s * 2) before it is considered "armed" and will deal damage. Think of it as if the missile has to travel 200 gu before being allowed to deal damage.
[ This Message was edited by: Fattierob on 2012-09-23 19:32 ]
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what happens if someone has 2 seconds desynch?
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The server is God. Regardless of whether you think you do or take damage, the server has the correct version of whatever happened, and will update you every 2 seconds.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2012-09-24 12:04
Quote:
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On 2012-09-24 04:48, Eledore Massis [R33] wrote:
To note;
When a missile is Launched it starts counting its own life.
When it Reaches arm-time; it will do damage.
when it Reaches maxlife; (+ enhancements) it will destroy itself.
As said above we use those + the missiles speed to calculate max and minimum ranges.
But, what to you might look as 300gu from ship to ship, for a missile with its arcing trajectory will take more then a 300gu flight length.
So technically it is possible to get shot & damaged just under the known minimal ranges. As they don't take into account the missiles arcing trajectory.
That said, it should be mentioned that the reverse, at maximum range, you will never be able to damage anyone, due to these trajectories. They will blow up before they even can hit the target..
E.
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Interesting.....so arm distance+selfdestruct distance are calculated by how long the missile has been alive and not by actual distance traveled, since vertical distance isn't counted as actual distance.
PD also doesn't count vertical distance and can shoot things that are above or below as long as it's within beam range horizontally, which always made me laugh when people were crying about Sparrows fired from MFs being "too high to PD".
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-DBS
Marshal
Joined: January 04, 2011
Posts: 204
From: St. Petersburg, FL
| Posted: 2012-09-24 16:36
It takes the server 2 seconds to update damage done, recieved? Wow, thats a long time...
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*Neon*
Chief Marshal
Joined: February 02, 2010
Posts: 75
| Posted: 2012-09-24 16:55
I was there that night and saw nothing at all peculiar with the missiles. What I was wondering about was the hive whos hull was repairing despite fire from two icc dreads and a station. That was weird.
[ This Message was edited by: Neonblue on 2012-09-24 16:58 ]
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Pantheon
Marshal
Palestar
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1789
| Posted: 2012-09-24 17:43
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On 2012-09-24 16:36, -DBS wrote:
It takes the server 2 seconds to update damage done, recieved? Wow, thats a long time...
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All clients simulate damage, which is fairly water tight. We only update all the clients every 2 seconds on the status of all ships. If we did it more often, we'd end up flooding your connections. So the server updates everything every 20th of a second but only updates your damage every 2 seconds.
[ This Message was edited by: Pantheon on 2012-09-24 17:44 ]
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Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2012-09-25 21:19
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On 2012-09-22 10:39, Whiterin wrote:
- Station camping
Not so much of a glitch or bug, it's pretty unfair, and I don't think it was intended as a game mechanic. Part of a station's job is to shield smaller or damaged ships. Some Luth players have been using this to there advantage, however. There have been several times where luth players, sometimes several of them at once, spawn siphons and sit on "top" of ICC stations. This makes it impossible to hit them with anything but beams, and since a siphon is a beam heavy ship, it gives them free reign to fire on anyone while remaing in relative safety of the enemy's station. This shouldn't be possible to do and can cause major balance issues in game.
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I have griped about this to no end. DS needs shove-able, enemy effecting tractor beams on stats. The old days you could keep them from or at least slow them from doing this and keep them off you completely if u knew what you were doing. Bring them back. At least it allows some tactics and defense for the stats.
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- Shroud Missles
While I personally feel these things are pretty OP normally (invisible, hard to detect even with ECCM, powerful, fast reload time, more accurate then the most accurate small missles of other factions), that's not the point of this post. Earlier today, myself and some other ICC were fighting stations. We were being hit, with nearly 100% accuracy, by shroud missles. The problem with this is, we were at point blank range, 200 gu or closer away from the station. We were being hit by beams and missles from the same station. Asking around, I found the minimum range of shrouds to be 300-350 gu... yet they were hitting, with great accuracy, at 200 gu, and sometimes even closer then that. I'm not sure if it's a glitch, abuse of game mechanics, or what... but it's pretty insane to be able to be hit by beams and missles at the same time while fighting.
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Shroud was a good idea 6 years ago (or was it longer...) when things like psi missles needed a scanner to detect, yet YOU could decide if you wanted to have one or not. No signal balancing, lag-potential calculating and adjusting.
Have scanner, turn on, see missles, Kill.
No scanner, dont see missles, run, curse, die.
Different system now, though.
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Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2012-09-25 21:22
btw, anyone who knows how to manually target can avoid issues with missles - especially shrouds - having a minimum distance. It really isnt that hard to figure out.... And the enemy doesnt see what the shrouds are doing until they have done did it.
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Pantheon
Marshal
Palestar
Joined: May 29, 2001
Posts: 1789
| Posted: 2012-09-26 07:04
Scanner should still light up all missiles and projectiles.
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Whiterin
Fleet Admiral
Joined: November 15, 2007
Posts: 146
| Posted: 2012-09-26 07:38
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On 2012-09-26 07:04, Pantheon wrote:
Scanner should still light up all missiles and projectiles.
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I think what he means is that it's no longer an option. You can't just put it on your ship if you want like you used to be able to do. There are only a hand full of ships that have it now.
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-(kha-ti the silent watcher)-
Grand Admiral
Joined: September 12, 2011
Posts: 185
From: the land of silent watchers
| Posted: 2012-09-26 08:19
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On 2012-09-26 07:38, Whiterin wrote:
Quote:
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On 2012-09-26 07:04, Pantheon wrote:
Scanner should still light up all missiles and projectiles.
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I think what he means is that it's no longer an option. You can't just put it on your ship if you want like you used to be able to do. There are only a hand full of ships that have it now.
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which is another reason why we encourage teamwork, If there are a handful of ships that use scanner then someone will want to join a party and help out their teammates.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2012-09-26 09:01
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On 2012-09-26 07:04, Pantheon wrote:
Scanner should still light up all missiles and projectiles.
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It don't, I've tried it, Shrouds are still invisible. Unless my desynch will also prevent everyone else from seeing them because it seems like I've always got a good amount of desynch in MV. Nonrendered missiles/fighters still happened with an active scanner as well.
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Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2012-09-26 12:28
to my knowledge, scanners havent lit up enemy missiles since .482. Mines, yes. But not missiles.
It was a function of the sysem then though; without a scanner, you couldnt see the missiles at all, if I remember right. If somebody kicked on a scanner, than people could see them fine. It wasnt part of the signature and ew system, though ecm could still mask them.
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