| Author |
CD vs CC |
Bardiche
Chief Marshal
Joined: November 16, 2006
Posts: 1247
|  Posted: 2012-11-18 09:41
I raised this issue earlier, and there is intention to construct a Command vessel for ICC that combines the philosophy of firepower and command capabilities to offer a suitable vessel from which to command the fleet.
I can't tell you when it'll be in the game, but I can tell you it will be in the game at some point. We really don't intend to give UGTO an Elite Assault Command Dreadnought and ICC a worse but mobile Command Station. I mean, we do, but ICC gets an Assault Command Dreadnought to go with the Carrier variant. Probably.
Don't quote me on this. In fact, don't quote me at all. The surest way to make a fool out of someone is by quoting them.
And yes.
I quoted someone there.
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-DBS
Marshal
Joined: January 04, 2011
Posts: 204
From: St. Petersburg, FL
| Posted: 2012-11-19 00:47
Cool! ^^ Not Quoted
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Brutality
Marshal
Joined: May 25, 2009
Posts: 659
From: Alaska, USA
| Posted: 2012-11-19 01:13
Was hoping that was the case but i hadn't seen anything about it since that thread was closed. I didn't know if that was the gameplan or not. 
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Challenger
Marshal
Joined: March 28, 2002
Posts: 886
| Posted: 2012-11-19 21:05
Moved from recruitment forum to here.
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DiepLuc
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 23, 2010
Posts: 1187
| Posted: 2012-11-19 22:49
Quote:
| On 2012-11-17 21:30, Fatal Brutality *COM* wrote:
Quote:
| On 2012-11-17 21:19, Talien wrote:
Quote:
| On 2012-11-17 21:10, chlorophyll wrote:
In the meantime, UGTO command dread fight like a violent orge and ICC Command carrier fight like a construction worker with a couple dart guns. |
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Fixed. |
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+1  |
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So true. I appreciate ;]
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SpaceAdmiral
Grand Admiral
Joined: May 05, 2010
Posts: 1005
| Posted: 2012-11-20 14:27
I think this stems from fighters being vastly underpowered compared to their point value in ship layouts. Almost all ships that have fighters are near useless save the command stations.
Agincourt: Only good at bombing planets, use command station instead if you want to do that. At longer ranges fighters will only get there once the battle ends.
Carrier Dread: The firepower it has is hilarious, can barely drive away a combat destroyer flying in straight lines. Fighters barely do anything as any targeted ship just jumps and comes back, jd recharges before you can get max fighters out. A Battle Dread has around 40-60% more firepower in exchange for dumping the fighters.
Command Carrier: Fighters were meant to be long range support while it defends a position by mining, repairing, and building. Except the fighters are near useless and by the time the fighters travel the long trek to the battlefield, the enemy likely has died or jumped away.
Brood: See above but with a few more cannons.
Carrier Cruisers: Just laughable, only merit is that it can stay closer to the fight so the fighters don't waste a year traveling to enemy.
The main users of fighters are the AI who have 8 fighters in addition to a normal Combat/Battle/Krill class dread layout with the armor of two stations. The reason why they can use fighters well is because in addition to having huge amounts, they can launch them at close range as they can tank through crud loads of damage, negating travel times. Any normal carrier would instead just be pounded into oblivion first.
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Whiterin
Fleet Admiral
Joined: November 15, 2007
Posts: 146
| Posted: 2012-11-22 03:51
Quote:
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Carrier Dread: The firepower it has is hilarious, can barely drive away a combat destroyer flying in straight lines. Fighters barely do anything as any targeted ship just jumps and comes back, jd recharges before you can get max fighters out. A Battle Dread has around 40-60% more firepower in exchange for dumping the fighters.
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I would much rather have the UGTO Carrier Dread then the ICC CC. The CC has highter requirements, and is useless. I remember liking the Carrier Dread, it wasn't too bad in combat. I even recall time beating both a Mandy and an ICC CD with my Carrier Dread. In the CC, I can't even defend myself from a frigate... You have a few light lasers, and that's it... Even when I enh the beams, I can't even fend off dessys and such when they come in close... it's utter useless. The ONLY reason I use it, is in situations where my engi has a chance of being destroyed, since it has 8x build drone enh...
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Hakketak
Grand Admiral
Joined: March 24, 2009
Posts: 301
| Posted: 2012-11-22 05:25
why did the dessies come in close? you got ecm and long ranged fighters...Did you get close to them? Also i thought a carrier is more a fleet ship, where u got some in asault and the carrier softens ppl up from afar.
With that in mind, build drones, ecm, loads of fighters, and ability to PD a whole lot, sounds good to me. If u want to do close range fighting u pick AD, or combat dread. If you want to hit people from huge range, or defend your station friend, the carrier or missle dread gets interesting.
If you take away carrier fighters and put on cannons that u cant use from 3K range, you take away the effectiveness of the ships role: long range fighter firepower. I feel its more in balance with the agincourt equivalent of the ugto then the standard carrier dread.
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-xTc- ExisT
Chief Marshal
Army Of Darkness
Joined: March 20, 2010
Posts: 534
From: Red Lobster
| Posted: 2012-11-22 11:15
Quote:
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On 2012-11-22 05:25, Bratwurst wrote:
why did the dessies come in close? you got ecm and long ranged fighters...Did you get close to them? Also i thought a carrier is more a fleet ship, where u got some in asault and the carrier softens ppl up from afar.
With that in mind, build drones, ecm, loads of fighters, and ability to PD a whole lot, sounds good to me. If u want to do close range fighting u pick AD, or combat dread. If you want to hit people from huge range, or defend your station friend, the carrier or missle dread gets interesting.
If you take away carrier fighters and put on cannons that u cant use from 3K range, you take away the effectiveness of the ships role: long range fighter firepower. I feel its more in balance with the agincourt equivalent of the ugto then the standard carrier dread.
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This may be true, it may be balanced for long range fleet support, but the issue arises because the brood/CC are so weak compared to the ugto CD. If theirs is strong, why can't ours be strong too? If ours are near useless, why can't theirs be useless too?
I believe that is the general argument
One could also say that one ship should not equal another faction ship; I agree, this isn't a 1v1 game after all, but it still doesn't change the fact that brood/CC are useless
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2012-11-22 12:39
IMHO, carriers should always be escorted by combat ships. This is a fleet game after all. Too many of you are thinking ship to ship combat in a one on one perspective. It doesn't always work that way.
But that being said, yes I do agree that:
- The CC and the Brood (to a lesser extent) needs a buff in the weapons loadout
- Fighters definitely need more bite and looking at to make carriers more viable
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Whiterin
Fleet Admiral
Joined: November 15, 2007
Posts: 146
| Posted: 2012-11-23 07:36
Quote:
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On 2012-11-22 05:25, Bratwurst wrote:
why did the dessies come in close? you got ecm and long ranged fighters...Did you get close to them? Also i thought a carrier is more a fleet ship, where u got some in asault and the carrier softens ppl up from afar.
With that in mind, build drones, ecm, loads of fighters, and ability to PD a whole lot, sounds good to me. If u want to do close range fighting u pick AD, or combat dread. If you want to hit people from huge range, or defend your station friend, the carrier or missle dread gets interesting.
If you take away carrier fighters and put on cannons that u cant use from 3K range, you take away the effectiveness of the ships role: long range fighter firepower. I feel its more in balance with the agincourt equivalent of the ugto then the standard carrier dread.
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You're joking right...?
The reason I mentioned defending myself from ships that come in close, is because that's the only time the CC can shoot something, because you know, it ONLY has regular lasers. Also, telling me to fight at range? Have you used fighters? I can't even destroy AI transports with them... yeah, that will be very effective against any enemy combat ship...
The reasons it are useless are:
- ECM/ECCM is pointless now.
- Fighters are virtually useless, some don't even work correctly.
- No ability to defend itself.
It's basically an engineer that costs 50x more pres if you die and can't be enhanced for build speed.
[ This Message was edited by: Whiterin on 2012-11-23 07:40 ]
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Hakketak
Grand Admiral
Joined: March 24, 2009
Posts: 301
| Posted: 2012-11-23 08:41
in that case u wouldnt mind this setup for a brood? i would like it
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Brutality
Marshal
Joined: May 25, 2009
Posts: 659
From: Alaska, USA
| Posted: 2012-11-23 13:54
Quote:
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On 2012-11-23 08:41, Bratwurst wrote:
in that case u wouldnt mind this setup for a brood? i would like it
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its a lot different when you have the luxury of cloak. The CC is a sitting duck and cannot easily hide.
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GunsOfHonor
Fleet Admiral
Joined: July 31, 2011
Posts: 191
| Posted: 2012-11-24 16:06
I'm going to chip in here.
If none of the dev's want to redo the CC. I have a brilliant idea. One that has been discussed.
-FIX THE FIGHTERS........
They suck and have so forever. Fix the fighters. and actually make the ships 3 ecm generators allow it to launch from 4000gu away without being seen.
The Fighters do 0 damage. Improve that and a few others and you have a good ship
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jacensolo
Vice Admiral
Joined: December 20, 2011
Posts: 52
| Posted: 2012-11-24 17:26
I think that the Command dread is kind of UGTO's odd one out. Most of the UGTO ships are designed to be: Stay-and-shoot, Stay-and-shoot-some-more, Shoot-and-kill.
The CD can be used to: Shoot-Jump-away.
At least that's what I've used it for in the Meta-verse.
I'm not sure about beta though.
In fact I'm not sure about anything!
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