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Ship Tiers and You |
Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
|  Posted: 2012-12-27 22:09
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On 2012-12-27 22:03, Zero28 wrote:
im havign a hard time understanding it
this just basicly sounds like you just gonna redo the current ships layout. cept your giving more options to lower rank players (wich i have no problems with)
doesn't that in the end falls back to where its at, players jsut gonna fly the biggest/highest tier ship they can get?
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The motivation for any player in any game that has better equipment for higher levels is to rank/level up to get the best stuff. That's normal, isn't it?
Right now, players want to rank up to get the biggest ship. Because bigger = better and more powerful.
But with the tiered system, bigger isn't necessarily better anymore. So, a T1 dread may not be as useful or powerful as a T2 cruiser. The configuration of the ship plays a part now. A very good current exampls is an ICC CC against a UGTO Torpedo Cruiser. Or an Agincourt vs an ICC HC/AC or Kluth Scale.
It's all about the ship layout. And the Tiered system will refine this concept.
[ This Message was edited by: Kenny_Naboo[+R] on 2012-12-27 22:10 ]
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Zero28
Grand Admiral
Joined: August 25, 2006
Posts: 591
| Posted: 2012-12-27 23:01
i see
yep, defenitly a good thiing XD.
thou iw ishe di coudl make my own layout, id been in a cruiser with cannosn and torps all the way xD
ima cannon kind of guy who likes to broadside XD
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-DBS
Marshal
Joined: January 04, 2011
Posts: 204
From: St. Petersburg, FL
| Posted: 2012-12-28 00:50
The pres gain should be increased to where it was 2 -3 years ago... For this new system...
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*FTL*Soulless
Marshal
Joined: June 25, 2010
Posts: 787
From: Dres-Kona
| Posted: 2012-12-28 01:05
hey jim could we get an example of how a ship would advance through the tiers? And by that i mean similer ship (Combat dessy) for one fraction would go alogng the tiers
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Jim Starluck
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: October 22, 2001
Posts: 2232
From: Cincinnati, OH
| Posted: 2012-12-28 01:45
Quote:
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On 2012-12-27 23:01, Zero28 wrote:
i see
yep, defenitly a good thiing XD.
thou iw ishe di coudl make my own layout, id been in a cruiser with cannosn and torps all the way xD
ima cannon kind of guy who likes to broadside XD
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That combo will probably be pretty common, especially for the human factions. Guns to hit at range, torps to hammer up close. It fits pretty closely with a number of existing ships; Combat and Gunboat destroyers, Heavy and Battle Cruisers, etc.
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On 2012-12-28 01:05, Soulless. wrote:
hey jim could we get an example of how a ship would advance through the tiers? And by that i mean similer ship (Combat dessy) for one fraction would go alogng the tiers
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Ships won't exactly "advance" through the tiers. You don't start with a Tier 1 Combat Destroyer, then get a Tier 2 Combat Destroyer, and then a Tier 3 Combat destroyer. The roles that comprise the Combat Destroyer will see use at all tiers, however.
Let me explain it this way. Here's a Tier 1 ICC Destroyer with a Cannon role:
M-190L Patrol Destroyer
Layout:
- 1x Tachyon Drive
- 2x IE Engine
- 4x Active Shields
- 5x Composite Armor
- 1x Pulse Shield
- 2x Full-arc Point Defense Beam
- 2x Dual-arc Chemical Laser
- 3x Tri-arc Heavy Railgun
- 1x Tri-arc Railgun
- 2x Aux Reactors
Now here's the Combat Destroyer, a Tier 2 ICC Destroyer with both Cannons and Torpedoes (Like I said, Zero28, a common combo  ):
M-190L/T Combat Destroyer
Layout:
- 1x Tachyon Drive
- 2x IE Engine
- 4x Active Shields
- 4x Composite Armor
- 1x Pulse Shield
- 2x Full-arc Point Defense Beam
- 2x Dual-arc Chemical Laser
- 4x Dual-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 6x Single-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 3x Tri-arc Heavy Railgun
- 4x Dual-arc Railgun
- 2x Aux Reactors
And at Tier 3 we have the Rapid Assault Destroyer with Cannons, Torpedoes and Beams:
M-194X Rapid Assault Destroyer
Layout:
- 1x Tachyon Drive
- 2x IE Drive
- 5x Composite Armor
- 4x Active Shields
- 1x Pulse Shield
- 2x Full-arc Point-defense Beam
- 1x Fore-arc Heavy Chemical Laser
- 4x Dual-arc Standard Chemical Laser
- 4x Tri-arc Heavy Railgun
- 6x Dual-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 4x Fore-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 3x Auxiliary Fusion Generator
All three ships have cannons, but this isn't Pokemon. The Patrol Destroyer doesn't evolve into the Combat Destroyer and then the Rapid Assault; they're three different ships, each at a different tier and with a different set of Roles. They just have one Role in common is all.
[ This Message was edited by: Jim Starluck on 2012-12-28 01:46 ]
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Supertrooper
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: March 18, 2004
Posts: 1895
From: Maryland, U.S.A
| Posted: 2012-12-28 02:10
I think the new ship tiers will be greeat for the game. I think it'll force players to work for the ships that they want. I know I know. You do that already by the rank structure. Gaining rank however is alot easier than it used to be in this game. You now have NPC's to shoot at which yield combat pres. When I first started playing, I had to earn combat pres by shooting other players because NPC's were'nt around in abundance back then. So, it took me 2 years to get to GA. My point is, stop complaining and be thankful that the devs are trying to bring new stuff to the game. They do work for free ya know.
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Brutality
Marshal
Joined: May 25, 2009
Posts: 659
From: Alaska, USA
| Posted: 2012-12-28 02:58
Thanks for the responses jim, they answered my questions completely. 
Another question I thought of is that if there is going to be more ship layouts added, is the garage space going to be increased as well or are we going to be stuck with selecting what 8 ships we want to leave ehs on in the garage? If that hasn't been addressed yet I understand, but I thought it was worth at least bringing up.
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Forger of Destiny
Chief Marshal
We Kick Arse
Joined: October 10, 2009
Posts: 826
| Posted: 2012-12-28 06:34
the subscribers will get 12 slots in their garage, so in a way thats a yes.
working with 8 might be a little difficult, but if one plays only 1 faction then its manageable.
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P2.
Marshal
*Renegade Space Marines*
Joined: December 08, 2005
Posts: 140
From: Bahia Blanca, Buenos Aires, Argentina
| Posted: 2012-12-28 08:10
As I always say,
Any change is welcome.
We must adapt and learn to work with them.
However, I hope that this work will be accompanied by the new maps.
Because I think that's a very important issue which is still pending.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2012-12-28 10:58
Quote:
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On 2012-12-28 01:45, Jim Starluck wrote:
Ships won't exactly "advance" through the tiers. You don't start with a Tier 1 Combat Destroyer, then get a Tier 2 Combat Destroyer, and then a Tier 3 Combat destroyer. The roles that comprise the Combat Destroyer will see use at all tiers, however.
Let me explain it this way. Here's a Tier 1 ICC Destroyer with a Cannon role:
M-190L Patrol Destroyer
Layout:
- 1x Tachyon Drive
- 2x IE Engine
- 4x Active Shields
- 5x Composite Armor
- 1x Pulse Shield
- 2x Full-arc Point Defense Beam
- 2x Dual-arc Chemical Laser
- 3x Tri-arc Heavy Railgun
- 1x Tri-arc Railgun
- 2x Aux Reactors
Now here's the Combat Destroyer, a Tier 2 ICC Destroyer with both Cannons and Torpedoes (Like I said, Zero28, a common combo ):
M-190L/T Combat Destroyer
Layout:
- 1x Tachyon Drive
- 2x IE Engine
- 4x Active Shields
- 4x Composite Armor
- 1x Pulse Shield
- 2x Full-arc Point Defense Beam
- 2x Dual-arc Chemical Laser
- 4x Dual-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 6x Single-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 3x Tri-arc Heavy Railgun
- 4x Dual-arc Railgun
- 2x Aux Reactors
And at Tier 3 we have the Rapid Assault Destroyer with Cannons, Torpedoes and Beams:
M-194X Rapid Assault Destroyer
Layout:
- 1x Tachyon Drive
- 2x IE Drive
- 5x Composite Armor
- 4x Active Shields
- 1x Pulse Shield
- 2x Full-arc Point-defense Beam
- 1x Fore-arc Heavy Chemical Laser
- 4x Dual-arc Standard Chemical Laser
- 4x Tri-arc Heavy Railgun
- 6x Dual-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 4x Fore-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 3x Auxiliary Fusion Generator
All three ships have cannons, but this isn't Pokemon. The Patrol Destroyer doesn't evolve into the Combat Destroyer and then the Rapid Assault; they're three different ships, each at a different tier and with a different set of Roles. They just have one Role in common is all. |
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That's actually kinda disappointing. From the way you put it earlier about lower tier ships being more specialized it made it sound like they'd have more weapons of one type, and higher tier ships would be more diverse in their loadouts but not be able to do one single role as well as a more specialized lower tier ship. But if what you just posted here is accurate and not just something you pulled out of a hat as an example, the higher tier ships can do what a lower tier ship can do, only better, plus with another role added in.
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The Fridge
Chief Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: December 13, 2008
Posts: 559
From: In Your Fridge, Eating your Foods.
| Posted: 2012-12-28 11:04
There still subject to change.
Although that specific Tier 1 should get more armour and a few more cannons in my opinion aswell.
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Walrus of Apathy
Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: August 07, 2005
Posts: 466
From: Dorans Basement
| Posted: 2012-12-28 12:54
Quote:
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On 2012-12-28 08:10, P2. wrote:
As I always say,
Any change is welcome.
We must adapt and learn to work with them.
However, I hope that this work will be accompanied by the new maps.
Because I think that's a very important issue which is still pending.
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New map is in the works, along with a revamped system that will let people chat across servers.
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Zero28
Grand Admiral
Joined: August 25, 2006
Posts: 591
| Posted: 2012-12-28 13:40
Quote:
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On 2012-12-28 10:58, Talien wrote:
Quote:
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On 2012-12-28 01:45, Jim Starluck wrote:
Ships won't exactly "advance" through the tiers. You don't start with a Tier 1 Combat Destroyer, then get a Tier 2 Combat Destroyer, and then a Tier 3 Combat destroyer. The roles that comprise the Combat Destroyer will see use at all tiers, however.
Let me explain it this way. Here's a Tier 1 ICC Destroyer with a Cannon role:
M-190L Patrol Destroyer
Layout:
- 1x Tachyon Drive
- 2x IE Engine
- 4x Active Shields
- 5x Composite Armor
- 1x Pulse Shield
- 2x Full-arc Point Defense Beam
- 2x Dual-arc Chemical Laser
- 3x Tri-arc Heavy Railgun
- 1x Tri-arc Railgun
- 2x Aux Reactors
Now here's the Combat Destroyer, a Tier 2 ICC Destroyer with both Cannons and Torpedoes (Like I said, Zero28, a common combo ):
M-190L/T Combat Destroyer
Layout:
- 1x Tachyon Drive
- 2x IE Engine
- 4x Active Shields
- 4x Composite Armor
- 1x Pulse Shield
- 2x Full-arc Point Defense Beam
- 2x Dual-arc Chemical Laser
- 4x Dual-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 6x Single-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 3x Tri-arc Heavy Railgun
- 4x Dual-arc Railgun
- 2x Aux Reactors
And at Tier 3 we have the Rapid Assault Destroyer with Cannons, Torpedoes and Beams:
M-194X Rapid Assault Destroyer
Layout:
- 1x Tachyon Drive
- 2x IE Drive
- 5x Composite Armor
- 4x Active Shields
- 1x Pulse Shield
- 2x Full-arc Point-defense Beam
- 1x Fore-arc Heavy Chemical Laser
- 4x Dual-arc Standard Chemical Laser
- 4x Tri-arc Heavy Railgun
- 6x Dual-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 4x Fore-arc Fusion Torpedo
- 3x Auxiliary Fusion Generator
All three ships have cannons, but this isn't Pokemon. The Patrol Destroyer doesn't evolve into the Combat Destroyer and then the Rapid Assault; they're three different ships, each at a different tier and with a different set of Roles. They just have one Role in common is all. |
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That's actually kinda disappointing. From the way you put it earlier about lower tier ships being more specialized it made it sound like they'd have more weapons of one type, and higher tier ships would be more diverse in their loadouts but not be able to do one single role as well as a more specialized lower tier ship. But if what you just posted here is accurate and not just something you pulled out of a hat as an example, the higher tier ships can do what a lower tier ship can do, only better, plus with another role added in.
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this
this si the reason i hard a slight hard tiem to understand, the systme is on a good paths. but basicly, yuv jsut iven access to bigger ships (tier 1 cruisers, Dessie etc) to lower rank players, wich is good. then they mvoe to tier 2 ships as they get more prestige
but in the end, people gonna stick to the ships that has more gadgets/weapons cuz they jsut deals more. and in the end, EAD is gonna still be the shp people gonna fly most (its jsut that harder to get) cuz lower tiered (and probably smaller ships to) dont have just as much gadgets/weapons
so it sounds like its changes one problem to another, wich leads to where we are now (slight chance you gonna see less dreads and more tier 3 cruisers)
[ This Message was edited by: Zero28 on 2012-12-28 13:42 ]
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DiepLuc
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 23, 2010
Posts: 1187
| Posted: 2012-12-28 13:48
From Jim's example through tier 1 to tier 3 ICC destroyer, I have a few speculations:
- There shall be more ships, along old-ships-in-new-layouts.
- Ship's design follows role orientation and roles combination.
- More weapons, gadgets. And the values are going to be changed to rebalance.
Few questions:
- If the new layout of the current ship gets different far from the old layout and we're no longer satisfied with the enhancement set up on the old one, can we ask for fractional refund?
- May the rank and requirement of the current ship unchanged? It's kind of unhappy when the new version release and we find us unable to launch our EAD/AD/Siphon because it'll be CM rank.
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YIIMM
Grand Admiral
Joined: June 16, 2005
Posts: 851
From: Barcino, Hispania Tarraconensis
| Posted: 2012-12-28 22:02
As someone who dislikes flying anything bigger than a cruiser (I do have a dread and a station in my garage but they almost never see the light of day) I welcome this change wholeheartedly.
I have a hell of a lot more fun flying the smaller ships but almost always find myself in the minority surrounded by dreads and stations. Having the fleets so top-heavy means a lot of ships that the devs have gone to the trouble of creating and balancing almost never get used.
I couldn't see a solution to dreadspace but I think this may do the trick.
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