| Author |
Scenario Servers |
Leonide
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: October 01, 2005
Posts: 1553
From: Newport News, Virginia
|  Posted: 2009-07-03 04:31
^ i am SO not reading that.
i advocate fixing the bugs and throwing the weight behind scenarios. i long since stopped playing MV.
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captain of the ICC Assault Cruiser C.S.S. Sledgehammer
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2009-07-03 08:12
Quote:
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On 2009-06-26 23:01, Sensitivity wrote:
Well, they're back and running; what do yall think of them? Too long? Too little bonus prestige? Thoughts? Concerns? Post them here and discuss!
Common Issues:
-The "dread rush" phenomenon
-Players starting at different times
-One sided battles (frigates vs dreads)
-Sabotage (locking planets, scrapping, giving away intel, ect)
-SY doesn't drain resource when spawning ships
-Wrong planet names(what happened to smartinville?)
-Should faction assignment be randomised?
-Should it be continued?
-How can it be improved?
-Should we have AI?
-ect.
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Haven't been playing this freel trial since nothing really changed except for the station nerf that I don't agree with, but I do know that this version's system of ship vs ship balance is not scenario-friendly. The one-sided battles you mention are made worse in this version because of the overwhelming superiority of dreads. It's supposed to be 1 dread = 2 cruisers, 1 cruiser = 2 destroyers, but ingame it's skewed much more in favor of dreads.
I'm not sure what the "dread rush" phenomenon is. Is that when people are rushing to get their dreads? Understandable because like I said in this version dreads rule, even over stations (bleh). It's not good for a fun scenario game to have everyone just rush toward the high ships, especially when there's a time limit.
In previous versions where scenarios shined, destroyers and cruisers were perfectly capable ships and in fact preferred over dreads. You'd see one here and there, even a station every once in a while, but most battles were destroyers and cruisers.
Sabotage can't be prevented fully. I think a log of who scrapped what would help, but other than that it can't be stopped.
SYs not draining resources? I'd rather see no SY at all in scenarios. They don't belong. Scenarios were a ton of fun way before SYs were even thought of.
The rest of it, like AI, I have no opinion on. I'd rather not see them, especially engineers, but maybe the old starport transports might work. Scenarios should get enough players that no AI are necessary.
Like I've said, this version is not good for scenarios. IF Faustus changed course and started reverse-developing Darkspace to achieve something near .480, this game would be a lot of fun again and I might return. But as it stands I'm not, and the station nerf was the final nail in the coffin for me since stations were the only thing keeping this game from being Dreadspace (not the reloads which I agree with, the offensive nerf). No SYs and no time limit on scenarios like the old days would be awesome.
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BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11183
From: Bristol, England
| Posted: 2009-07-03 10:03
More constructive comments and such please.
Example:
"Scenario was more fun before shipyards." - Why?
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Pakhos[+R]
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: May 31, 2002
Posts: 1352
From: Clean room lab
| Posted: 2009-07-03 10:14
Quote:
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On 2009-07-03 10:03, BackSlash *Jack* wrote:
More constructive comments and such please.
Example:
"Scenario was more fun before shipyards." - Why?
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There wont be a big difference with sy or without it . Earlier pacthes had no sy but we still needed to have some res to spawn bigger ship. Only differences were , all friendly planets total res used to spawn bigger ship and spawn from gates instead of spawn from sy and using one planet res.
[ This Message was edited by: Pakhos on 2009-07-03 10:42 ]
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Pope
Fleet Admiral
Joined: June 11, 2002
Posts: 2449
From: World of tomorrow
| Posted: 2009-07-03 10:19
I believe if SY actually uses res for spawning a ship, the dread spam problem would kindof solve itself.. one EAD can't stop a whole fleet.
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cctv dude99
2nd Rear Admiral
Joined: February 20, 2009
Posts: 30
| Posted: 2009-07-03 10:24
AI - Please get rid of them! In the first round if you go as ICC you often find you have millions of AI, both enemy and yours - I often can't see where I'm flying. Also, I noticed no matter what you do, Mycopia just rebels to UGTO, meaning ICC can't stop the UGTO in that first round, but the annoying thing is, you have about 50 AI trying to defeat the UGTO when its impossible!! Once the UGTO was trying to win the first round (otherwise everyone gets bored), but the AI blockaded there shipyard so it was impossible for them to win too, meaning it was a stalemate for the whole round. I think there should be more K'Luth in scenario, because I only know of one round in which they have been in, so they should appear earlier on and stay there for at least 2 rounds.
Right now for my final rant.
It would be good if there were more objectives in the rounds. Just capping planets is boring and easy. I was once up against 2 others (who werent really noobs, but...) while I was on my own and I trashed them. With more objectives it would have been MUCH harder.
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Bardiche
Chief Marshal
Joined: November 16, 2006
Posts: 1247
| Posted: 2009-07-03 11:22
re: ships aren't balanced for scenario
Bullocks. Lark and I aren't the bestest pilots around and we beat a Dreadnought in Destroyers.
Vigilus can defeat Cruisers in his Combat Destroyer.
spatula_ninja can go toe to toe with a Battle Dreadnought in an Assault Cruiser.
Two Assault Cruisers would beat a Battle Dreadnought without too much effort.
Game balance is good right now. Not perfect, but perfection's the child of the gods, not of man.
I seriously think the focus should be put more on scenario and less on metaverse.
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Grimith
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: August 09, 2003
Posts: 836
From: Your local future farm.
| Posted: 2009-07-03 12:43
It’s saddening to read that you didn’t have the heart - or care - to read through what Purpura wrote, Leonide.
Quote:
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On 2009-07-03 01:08, Purpura wrote:
The point Im trying to make is that I and a great many other people Played and paid for this game specificly to play mainly in the FA Server, as the mv felt like nothing was being accomplished capping the same planets over and over, only to do the same thing the very next day cuz some1 capped all the ones you capped while you were sleeping lol gave it a stale feeling
In FA there was a deffinate goal and accomplishment, it was like "We Won this match, and this match will never be replayed, this match was the only one of its kind and we won" as even if the map was the same next time, the players and the movements never were, each game was unique and special in its own way, each new game fresh. Kinda like how you can play Chess or poker 10 times ina row and still wanna play that next game lol |
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Purpura’s post is what’s inspiring me to write right now.
There are several things I’ve disliked about scenario-play since I started playing this game. I’m a builder-at-heart, so engineering has always been a challenge in Scenario (I remember the frantic research to Dbases in 1.480 and trying to protect the Colony Hub until the research was complete). Work spent building up a storage of resources could easily be erased by anyone who just logged in and decided, “Well, this dreadnought is a GREAT IDEA!, let alone the fact that it’s going to get OWNED by cruisers.” Or the demands of, “GET HUMAN PLANET NOW FOR CL2KS!!!” The “teams by rank, not by players” bit really aggravated me, especially as I earned more and more prestige. Rank doesn’t bloody matter when you’re all relegated to the same class of ships. I could go on, but some of the points (like the CL2Ks thing I mentioned earlier) are obsolete. Overall, though, when I grew out of scenario and desired a more consistent, larger playing field, I resented scenario for taking away so many players who could be in the Metaverse.
Despite these points, however, I still found scenario enjoyable. And I still do.
I’ve played DarkSpace off and on over the past several days during the free trial, trying to gauge whether the game’s worth spending my money on it again - the last time I did so, my money ended up going to waste because I got tired of playing. Although I would love to go into the MV and spend hours building planets from scratch and learn new and better ways to engineer in this particular version, that option... well... doesn’t really exist. Instead, I’ve been playing mostly scenario, and I’ve been enjoying it. Fast-paced small-ship combat and the rush to try and achieve, then defend objectives has really been calling out to me.
The scenario has a defined objective, and there are only so many hours in which to achieve the objective. Accomplishing the objective is fun, just in order to say, “We won this match,” but I also remember the wave of “ggs” that used to pass in scenario, even from the losers, just to say, “Ah, well, darn, at least we all had fun.”
And that’s what mattered: Fun.
- Edit: Typos. Bad typos.
[ This Message was edited by: Grimith on 2009-07-03 12:47 ]
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Bardiche
Chief Marshal
Joined: November 16, 2006
Posts: 1247
| Posted: 2009-07-03 13:07
I still see those waves of "ggs" coming up when scenarios end. I love how everyone pulls together.
"Does anyone need an Extractor?"
"Can someone engineer Mycopia for me?"
"Just build, I'll distract the enemy."
"Okay, gonna bomb Epsilon, can someone guard me?"
"Oh crap, they've got Cruisers. Quick, get Extractors everyone!!"
Lately all I see in the metaserver is "combat or supply?" and "Stop farming AI and come help beat K'Luth".
There isn't any real strategy involved because Stations + Dreadnoughts + Spacebar smash seems to be prevalent.
Seeing Engineer/Extractor rushes in scenario is just amazing to see, and it's wonderful being able to construct different sorts of planets just to see what works and what doesn't.
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Fattierob
Vice Admiral
Joined: April 25, 2003
Posts: 4059
| Posted: 2009-07-03 13:07
Quote:
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On 2009-07-03 11:22, Bardiche wrote:
re: ships aren't balanced for scenario
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I think the only thing that needs looking at is the UGTO assault corvette, the lack of an ICC equivalant (The Recon and Phantom scouts are pretty much the same thing), and the lack of an "assault" UGTO/ICC Frigate (Harrier notwithstanding)
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Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2009-07-03 13:22
Ai in servers would be great if they made more sense. It seems the realism is whats missing. Where are the civilian and merchant class AI? Why is the only AI military class? It would be cool if there were merchant class and civilian class AI, worth less pres for destroying. Have a few AI military ships around, and when the other AI send out a distress, the military class AI could come out in droves to respond to the distress and defend the territory or ships under attack.
The response of the AI can be tailored to the number of human players in the server at that time as well. That way there isn't a total overkill of AI and human players, but it could add another dimension for those times when there aren't many humans on, thus giving the humans that are on more to do.
Kind of like the old transports, just expanded a little more.
just a thought. Not sure if this passes Jackslash's opinion of constructive, but I tried 
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2009-07-03 14:37
Quote:
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On 2009-07-03 10:03, BackSlash *Jack* wrote:
More constructive comments and such please.
Example:
"Scenario was more fun before shipyards." - Why?
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What do you care, I don't even play anymore.
Scenarios were fun before SYs because you didn't need to worry about losing one, you didn't need to wait to build one, you didn't have to worry about defending one, you didn't have to worry about getting all the necessary resources to one. Every ship was available from the gate so long as you had the proper planets. If you lose your SY in a scenario, you can't get the larger ships. I personally don't like that. The gate is a guaranteed spawn point that you don't have to build, can't be bombed and can't be blockaded.
I like the old Darkspace. Sorry, what can I say? I liked it when ships didn't have dozens of different weapons, but it was still balanced (I have screenshots of those old layouts. 3 CLs and 5 missiles made for a pretty good ship). I liked it when missiles were accurate and did damage. I actually liked it when Kluth had no armor but did massive damage. I liked ECM forts. I liked that dreads were fairly uncommon, and stations pretty rare, but when one side did manage to get some of them out everyone rallied around them. I liked when scenarios were popular but the MV wasn't. I liked the game before interdictors. I liked when planets didn't rotate and you could build solar generators and defense bases according to which way you thought the enemy would approach. I liked when mines were useful and dangerous.
As for balance, umm the game isn't even really balanced for the MV, unless you consider "balance" to be the current thinking that bigger ships must be more powerful. It's DREADspace now. You do see the occasional cruiser and destroyer in the MV, but usually it's because they can't fly their dreads yet. 1.480 had a good balance in my opinion. I preferred the versions where the cruisers and destroyers were the most popular ships. Not everyone preferred the game that way though.
I'll tell you one thing: I haven't played an online game that has gone through as many drastic changes as this game. Some do evolve over time, sure. But that's usually in the form of expansions and added content, not completely revamped current content over and over. This game doesn't know what it wants to be. Even an old game like Everquest took a lot of expansions before the original content started being altered, and even then it was mostly just zone and map changes, not total balance and gameplay changes.
[ This Message was edited by: MrSparkle on 2009-07-03 14:45 ]
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2009-07-03 14:49
Oops one more thing: Bringing back scenarios is the perfect first step in the right direction. But it's a first step, not a final step. I will lurk and observe as things progress, but I do know that if 1.5 remains as it is I won't be back. I liked 1.5 right after release (in case anyone forgot) but in true Darkspace fashion it got changed too much with patches.
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Azreal
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004
Posts: 2816
From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2009-07-03 14:55
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On 2009-07-03 14:49, MrSparkle wrote:
Oops one more thing: Bringing back scenarios is the perfect first step in the right direction. But it's a first step, not a final step. I will lurk and observe as things progress, but I do know that if 1.5 remains as it is I won't be back. I liked 1.5 right after release (in case anyone forgot) but in true Darkspace fashion it got changed too much with patches.
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I so am in agreement with that. 1.5 brought me back. The constant nerfing and so-called tweaking for "balance" is killing it again for me. Get used to a ship, and then it changes. Get used to a weapon, it gets nerfed. All along all we wanted was the buggs to get fixxed. Instead it keeps devolving. It isn't evolving, for sure. I don't mind adapting, but it's starting to get stupid now.
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-Daedalus-
Grand Admiral
Joined: September 26, 2006
Posts: 549
| Posted: 2009-07-03 17:24
The fun i've had in Scenarios may be the main reason I resubscribe. I find MV is the most boring place on earth. Hell I once fell asleep waiting for someone to make a move.
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