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Sitting on Stations |
Fattierob Vice Admiral
Joined: April 25, 2003 Posts: 4059
| Posted: 2012-10-10 08:49  
Beams fired from your ship should not be damaging your ship. If they are, report it as a bug with steps to get it working. Don't say something like "in the middle of combat I fired my beams and took damage so therefore the beams I fired did damage to me" because that is like saying "in the middle of combat I fired my beams and the ambient air pressure dropped by 20 pascals and I took damage so therefore air pressure did damage to me"
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Zero28 Grand Admiral
Joined: August 25, 2006 Posts: 591
| Posted: 2012-10-10 08:55  
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On 2012-10-09 17:15, Hyperforce wrote:
this is like saying its abuse to attack Assault dreads from the rear in a parasite ...
[ This Message was edited by: Zero28[Helper] on 2012-10-10 09:02 ]
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How in the world can you even compare that? Shooting an AD in the back in a parasite is not even close, it facts if you do so, your still able to be fired upon by the AD and everyone else around it/you
Unlike the station sit, where only the station caa hit you, cuz everyone else around will FF station no matter where they are
the 2 dont even compare
We have'nt seen much station sit until this post came up, now everyone and their grand-mothers does it.
The Station was Made to defend vessel using its wide arcs. at least that was the general idea but the mechanics has been stretched to a point that purpose is their downfall now.
@Fattie, i meant, if the beams (sfired by yur allies) goes trough you to hit enemy behind you,
YOu still get the damage even thou you visually see the beam hit the enemy behind XD
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Incinarator Chief Marshal
Joined: May 24, 2010 Posts: 237
| Posted: 2012-10-10 14:43  
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On 2012-10-09 17:29, rykros1987 wrote:
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On 2012-10-08 11:38, Fatal Incinarator |SoT| wrote:
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On 2012-10-08 10:48, rykros1987 wrote:
This issue goes even further then just stat sitting.
I found out earlier that there was a way to hide things like supply ships under a stats outer part of their dome.
Now from what I observed nothing could hit me while I was in the stat short of a ship explosion. 2 Kluth parasites tried to beam me focus fire wise while approaching pokeyourwaffle. They didnt even dent my side armor at all and i'm a heavy supply ship. They did hurt waffle though which suggests that the beams get absorbed.
This means that not even beams can hit you if you hide inside a stat in a defensive position against say a kluth assault.
Can you imagine people taking 1 stat/3 suppliers per stat and piling up on the enhanced repair rates? How rediculous would that be? I don't know for sure on exactly what the repair rate would be but it sounds like it would be rediculous. Coupling that with the concept of hiding in the stat for invulnerability is insane.
Also what if bigger ships like carriers or dreads can fit under there? I don't know as I don't have the badges to try but it makes it clearly evident that if even some ships can be immune to incoming fire while camping a station then its a problem.
[ This Message was edited by: rykros1987 on 2012-10-09 17:32 ]
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Just like sitting on top of stations offensively, this too has held true for a long time.
It is generally held as not only rediculous, but also impolite, for a friendly dread to camp on top of a station and use it as a shield, because that station now cannot fire upon the same target as the dread is, because it'll just do friendly fire damage. Furthermore, unless you are right on the edge of the station you cannot use anything but beams because projectiles will collide with the station, causing friendly fire damage.... in this position you can also be shot at with anything, so it gives you no benefit.
Typically, this is indeed used to shield combat supply ships from cover, and as far as I know, no one minds this usage. Supply ships have such a limited role and are so easy to kill that it isn't a big deal.
Anywho, the solution to the problem of killing the supply ship is easy: if you get on top of the station as well, your beams should be able to kill it, if you're that desperate to kill it.
Stations are also used to hide ships running point defense for them, but this is rarely seen because most people don't fly ships just to run point defense, and when they do they usually try to get the missiles before they reach the station.
Combat engineer ships can also build supply platforms inside of a station's ring to cover the plats as well, but this doesn't happen too often. This is one of the few times I do not approve of using stations as shields.
The only other time I see stations being used like this is to provide cover for damaged ships that are repairing, and if you really want to kill those ships the previous method for killing supply ships works here as well.
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Sure except for one fact. I wasn't on *top* of the stat. I was under its dome. I was on flat ground with the 2 charging parasites. Angle had nothing to do with it. Poke's ship literally absorbed 2 barrages of beams for me while im level with the enemies height. The kluth actually tried to kill me repeatedly and the only time I finally got even scratched was when poke moved because they felt it was unfair while I was taunting the kluth. Then when he moved away I tried to catch up and got caught by a mandible barrage and died. The only reason they seemed to be able to hit was due to poke moving away so I couldn't hide *under* his outer dome anymore.
So just to make it clear I wasn't hiding on *top* of the station like other people tend to do. I was literally under the dome next to the stem of the station.
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You're saying that you were still on the same, normal x-y playing field, but you were right next to the stats actual hull? The only way I have ever seen this happen is if you are on top of the station and you orbit a planet. When you orbit the planet the game forces your z-coordinate to zero, causing you to 'sink' into the station you were sitting on top of. If this is what you were referring to, then it has no bearings on the matter. Everything discussed before still applies to this condition.
_________________ I be rebuilding your planets!
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Talien Marshal Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010 Posts: 2044 From: Michigan
| Posted: 2012-10-10 16:57  
You know, I look at the title of this thread and suddenly it hits me. LoA was more of a visionary than anyone gave him credit for.....I mean, he DID create the barstool afterall.
_________________ Adapt or die.
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Borgie Chief Marshal Pitch Black
Joined: August 15, 2005 Posts: 2256 From: close by
| Posted: 2012-10-10 22:33  
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On 2012-10-10 08:49, Fattierob wrote:
Beams fired from your ship should not be damaging your ship. If they are, report it as a bug with steps to get it working. Don't say something like "in the middle of combat I fired my beams and took damage so therefore the beams I fired did damage to me" because that is like saying "in the middle of combat I fired my beams and the ambient air pressure dropped by 20 pascals and I took damage so therefore air pressure did damage to me"
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what im thinking is that those stations are firing off there core's and damaging them selves
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Kenny_Naboo Marshal Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010 Posts: 3823 From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2012-10-10 23:46  
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On 2012-10-10 16:57, Talien wrote:
You know, I look at the title of this thread and suddenly it hits me. LoA was more of a visionary than anyone gave him credit for.....I mean, he DID create the barstool afterall.
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Yep. There's that nice dark cushioned spot there on the top for a Siphon to plonk his ass down.
Perfect.
_________________ ... in space, no one can hear you scream.....
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Scorched Soul[+R] Marshal Pitch Black
Joined: November 14, 2005 Posts: 378 From: USA, NJ, Princeton
| Posted: 2012-10-11 01:48  
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Blackjack [DBL] Grand Admiral Faster than Light
Joined: February 25, 2011 Posts: 344 From: The land of venomous reptiles.
| Posted: 2012-10-11 04:56  
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Names I used: Da Bes Loser, Perseverance, Loyalty.
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Rykros1987 Fleet Admiral
Joined: October 01, 2012 Posts: 88 From: Not in an asylum. Yet.
| Posted: 2012-10-11 09:53  
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On 2012-10-10 14:43, Fatal Incinarator |SoT| wrote:
You're saying that you were still on the same, normal x-y playing field, but you were right next to the stats actual hull? The only way I have ever seen this happen is if you are on top of the station and you orbit a planet. When you orbit the planet the game forces your z-coordinate to zero, causing you to 'sink' into the station you were sitting on top of. If this is what you were referring to, then it has no bearings on the matter. Everything discussed before still applies to this condition.
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How does it not have any bearings on the matter? Sure its not exactly the same as sitting on top but it does involve absorbing all the damage sent at you with a station while repairing it and only having to float in one spot without moving. It's a similiar thing though... just more limited on scenarios.(having to be near a planet)
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Incinarator Chief Marshal
Joined: May 24, 2010 Posts: 237
| Posted: 2012-10-11 14:23  
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On 2012-10-11 09:53, rykros1987 wrote:
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On 2012-10-10 14:43, Fatal Incinarator |SoT| wrote:
You're saying that you were still on the same, normal x-y playing field, but you were right next to the stats actual hull? The only way I have ever seen this happen is if you are on top of the station and you orbit a planet. When you orbit the planet the game forces your z-coordinate to zero, causing you to 'sink' into the station you were sitting on top of. If this is what you were referring to, then it has no bearings on the matter. Everything discussed before still applies to this condition.
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How does it not have any bearings on the matter? Sure its not exactly the same as sitting on top but it does involve absorbing all the damage sent at you with a station while repairing it and only having to float in one spot without moving. It's a similiar thing though... just more limited on scenarios.(having to be near a planet)
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Because, as I said, all the same conditions still apply. You will not take damage from outside sources, you can only take damage from splash and from ships firing lasers inside of the arcs of the station. The situation is exactly the same as sitting on top of the station, gameplay wise.
_________________ I be rebuilding your planets!
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Sparkx Vice Admiral
Joined: September 11, 2012 Posts: 18 From: St. Pete, FL
| Posted: 2012-10-12 01:19  
Lets just put out a bunch of red tape so no one gets hurt from now on. Please outfit all ships with Nerf guns, so that there are no more hurt feeling plz...
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Scorched Soul[+R] Marshal Pitch Black
Joined: November 14, 2005 Posts: 378 From: USA, NJ, Princeton
| Posted: 2012-10-12 11:47  
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On 2012-10-12 01:19, Hide wrote:
Lets just put out a bunch of red tape so no one gets hurt from now on. Please outfit all ships with Nerf guns, so that there are no more hurt feeling plz...
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Something makes me doubt that you have ever flown a station, let alone been sat on in one. Please go find a troll with experience in flying stations and come back but not before then.
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-xTc- ExisT Chief Marshal Army Of Darkness
Joined: March 20, 2010 Posts: 534 From: Red Lobster
| Posted: 2012-10-12 15:16  
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On 2012-10-12 11:47, Scorched Soul[+R][Help] wrote:
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On 2012-10-12 01:19, Hide wrote:
Lets just put out a bunch of red tape so no one gets hurt from now on. Please outfit all ships with Nerf guns, so that there are no more hurt feeling plz...
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Something makes me doubt that you have ever flown a station, let alone been sat on in one. Please go find a troll with experience in flying stations and come back but not before then.
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Im pretty sure hes an alt.
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Azreal Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2004 Posts: 2816 From: United State of Texas, Houston
| Posted: 2012-10-13 12:24  
8 pages of reasons I wont reinstall.
The original issue; a solvable issue with ships sitting on stations.
The community response; have an irrational, juvenile flame fest.
Tractors. Re-enable for use vs ships. Solved.
Not obstinance and vitriolic comments.
Stats have been nerfed in virtually every way to make them nearly useless. At least let them defend themselves from a pathetic weakling tactic ffs.
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Pantheon Marshal Palestar
Joined: May 29, 2001 Posts: 1789
| Posted: 2012-10-13 19:56  
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On 2012-10-13 12:24, Azreal wrote:
8 pages of reasons I wont reinstall.
Tractors. Re-enable for use vs ships. Solved.
Not obstinance and vitriolic comments.
Stats have been nerfed in virtually every way to make them nearly useless. At least let them defend themselves from a pathetic weakling tactic ffs.
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Solved, in your opinion. It doesn't mean it'll solve the problem. I wish people would stop assuming that their opinion is the right one, the only right one, and everything else is wrong and the reason the game sucks/x/y/z.
I'm not stating that there's not an issue, if you guys think it needs to be stopped, then it likely does (and on a personal note, I agree), however, it's not an easy issue to fix in any way, shape, or form, despite what some of you may be imagining is an 'easy fix' in your head.
Tractors can't be enabled due to the fact they cause syncronisation issues up the wazoo. There's no easy way to detect if a ship is 'inside' anothers hitbox, that would put far too much strain on the server trying to calculate that all the time. Not allowing the ship to go 'inside' the station would look beyond stupid : Dread heading at 20gu/s towards a station then all of a sudden, DEAD STOP.
The only thing I can think of that wouldn't look stupid, or involve something that won't work at all, is to make ships go further up the Z plane when going over other ships, so they can't 'hide' inside of it. [ This Message was edited by: Pantheon on 2012-10-13 20:00 ]
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