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[Beta] Dreadnaught layouts |
CM7
Midshipman
Faster than Light
Joined: October 15, 2009
Posts: 1812
|  Posted: 2011-05-13 03:27
by virtue of this, your saying armor is better even in the face of what ive proposed.... i really really really dont think so.. and if it is.. WTH
id rather elfs drain from energy pool as to not deny me the ability to fire.
You may ask yourself "whats the difference?" Its simple.. My engines/aux generators will work dilligently to restore power to gadgets dispite having energy reserves. Thus i can still fire..... just not as fast.
[ This Message was edited by: Defiance*XO* on 2011-05-13 03:30 ]
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-05-13 04:09
Quote:
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On 2011-05-13 03:27, Defiance*XO* wrote:
by virtue of this, your saying armor is better even in the face of what ive proposed.... i really really really dont think so.. and if it is.. WTH
id rather elfs drain from energy pool as to not deny me the ability to fire.
You may ask yourself "whats the difference?" Its simple.. My engines/aux generators will work dilligently to restore power to gadgets dispite having energy reserves. Thus i can still fire..... just not as fast.
[ This Message was edited by: Kenny_Naboo[+R] on 2011-05-13 04:16 ]
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Hey, it's up to you. Well.... it's up to the Devs actually. LOL. Our opinions may or may not be worth a damn.
Having a layer of armor underneath those shields will save your ass when it finally collapses. If you want to go all Starfleet and rely only on shields because of some stubborn faction design principle or paradigm, then that's your funeral.
Anyway, IMO, I still think that ICC shields need a bit of buffing. Somewhere in the order of 15 to 20% more strength.
But TBH, it will be interesting to see an ICC dread with all its armor removed, and having double the shielding....
As for the ELFs, either works for me. Either they drain your weaps (which will give the prey a distinct tactical disadvantage), or has a more pronounced effect on your main banks. All I know right now is that.... I tested 6 ELFs on an EAD at a distance of 50GUs, with both ships not moving. 10 units of energy drained. It's kinda useless.
Needs a buff somehow.
That, plus the EAD needs one aux gen and a rear armor layer removed.
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SpaceAdmiral
Grand Admiral
Joined: May 05, 2010
Posts: 1005
| Posted: 2011-05-13 05:58
@Kenny
I'm fine with buffing the siphon to EAD levels.
I'm fine with buffing elfs to deal significant damage.
I'm iffy on nerfing the EAD to siphon levels.
I'm iffy on buffing shields to armor levels.
I am certainly not fine on proposing all of the above at once.
Also, if shields become stronger than armor, then I really would like to see ICC actually have lesser firepower. Right now rails are same as pcannon @400 gu, uses same beams, and torps/cores are more acurate at the cost of some damage. ATM ICC is defensive because of shield rotation even though it has less total hp than armor. If they had the same hp as armor then there would be little downside to ICC, fair punch (strong punch at long range) with superior defense.
Because of various weapon buffs without defence buffs, battles will be shorter, with less time to jump out. Whoever shoots first will be much more important, already giving kluth a tremendous boost at alpha damages (I am aware of 15 second cloak timer). Shields will suffer in rotation rate, so an appropriate fix would be simply increasing how much shield power is transfered per click.
@Pakhos, I'm playing "Devil's Advocate" because not many UGTO are posting on the forums in regards to balance. This allows more aggressive Kluth and ICC memebers to drown out most UGTO arguments.
The most vocal group gets more representation, there was a time where Larky proposed fall-off to SIs with some percieved credibility, even though it would have nerfed kluth to death. (Also vocal at that time were ICC players stating missiles were fine even with the old pd) (old pd= fires 1 beam every second, effectively limmiting you to pding 2-3 missiles max)
Many people can complain on the grounds of "UGTO stations op", calling people playing UGTO "No-skilled noobs" or something of the like.
During that age of ripe QQ coming from every faction, UGTO became the unwanted faction, with ICC always being on the offensive and taking out major systems. Faction hoppers left UGTO, and it basically was present day ICC. Only did the retirement of most of the ICC leaders coupled with present day PD did UGTO become the favored "OP nooby" faction it is today. As a result, I do have a bias for UGTO, mainly because I lose myself a bit to insults thrown at UGTO and not many UGTO players go extensively into balance discussions. I did sympathize with Kluth small ships (especially cruisers) and am happy they are now somewhat viable.
TL;DR on the rant: If you remove some of your(refering to hostile people in general) (usually personally hostile) bias, I am very likely to be able to drop my bias and better understand your faction's point of view. I do have an alt, and have experienced how the currently overwhelming numbers of UGTO make it seem OP. I also know that faction powers frequently shift, with ICC dominating earlier 1.5. I am willing to be more open, but I can't be more open to hostile people.
[ This Message was edited by: SpaceAdmiral on 2011-05-13 06:07 ]
EDIT: And as proof of not many UGTO posting, in the 10-11 pages of this thread there are no fleeted UGTO players posting.
There is 1 near unbiased unfleeted poster and 3 unfleeted that are proly not UGTO.
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SaturnShadow™ *FC*(Angel Of Darkness)
Marshal
*Renegade Space Marines*
Joined: February 03, 2007
Posts: 310
From: UK
| Posted: 2011-05-13 06:26
i think the reason some or most fleeted UGTO havent posted is because we are happy with the UGTO layout and we dont mind the layouts of the icc or k'luth. Since im here ill give you my opinion on the UGTO dreads.
Carrier Dread: love the layout
Agincourt Dread: no complaints its main role is still there and can defend its self (against fighters and missiles)
Battle Dread: just how i like it a Cannon platform just like in 1.483 with some PD over it
Command Dread: I LOVE IT (apart from the lack of bombs and afew fighters) Mines on it are INSANE now apart from the 2 things i said in the brackets i think its had a nice trade off.
Elite Assault Dread: I adore it
i only got 2 things i would like to ask though
1. could we get some new models out there
2. could we get more ship layouts and new ships (this goes for all classes)
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Drafell
Grand Admiral
Mythica
Joined: May 30, 2003
Posts: 2449
From: United Kingdom
| Posted: 2011-05-13 06:39
This is where enhancements with a specific damage resistance come into play.
We will look into it.
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Enterprise
Chief Marshal
Joined: May 19, 2002
Posts: 2576
From: Hawthorne, Nevada
| Posted: 2011-05-13 08:08
ELF beams are still too ineffective. Even with the Siphon.
We can't go back to them draining from gadgets, because that was too OP if you cycled them.
If you want the ELF beam to be taken seriously, I'd say at least double what it drains. 24 energy? Really? Thats nothing when you're fighting just about anything, even if its got all its weapons going. I'd rather have raw firepower.
Which is exactly why the Siphon fails and so does the Parasite and the Drainer. The ELF beams don't do the kind of good they should do. If you get hit by them you should be thinking, crap, there goes my energy not, LOL Y U WASTE TIME?
-Ent
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Xpander
Chief Marshal
Portuguese Space Invaders
Joined: February 19, 2011
Posts: 32
From: Portugal
| Posted: 2011-05-13 08:27
hey to all
i agree with Enterprise....
6 elf beams = 24 energy drain
24 ??? just 24 ??
please double it , or it wont matter to have them
X
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BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11183
From: Bristol, England
| Posted: 2011-05-13 10:02
ELF beams are there to help you manage your energy, not manage it for you. As they are now, they allow you to sustain your firing for that little bit extra - offsetting the energy a number of weapons cost.
They will be staying as is.
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Pakhos[+R]
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: May 31, 2002
Posts: 1352
From: Clean room lab
| Posted: 2011-05-13 10:19
Quote:
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On 2011-05-13 10:02, BackSlash wrote:
ELF beams are there to help you manage your energy, not manage it for you. As they are now, they allow you to sustain your firing for that little bit extra - offsetting the energy a number of weapons cost.
They will be staying as is.
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I was claming space marine to be devil's advocate but guess what? You are the devil...
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Kenny_Naboo
Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: January 11, 2010
Posts: 3823
From: LobsterTown
| Posted: 2011-05-13 10:20
Again I repeat. 6 ELF beams drains only 10 energy. That, coupled with a 22 sec recharge timer makes it a serious waste of time. 6 slots which can go to other weapons are wasted on 6 beams that do bugger all. Each ELF beam takes away 1.6667 energy every 22 secs. Any ship can regenerate many times that amount in 22 secs.
I take issue with the description abt the Siph's description:
"To help feed the titanic energy needs of these weapons it also carries several ELF Beams to drain energy directly from its target, crippling its ability to fight back or flee."
It just ain't true.
If the ELFs are gonna remain as they are, pls swap them for aux gens or more SIs. As it is, they serve nothing more than being a nerf.
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BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11183
From: Bristol, England
| Posted: 2011-05-13 10:32
I just fired 6 ELF beams at 0.0 energy, with my drives off, etc.
28.2 energy gained. That's 16.3% of your energy back every 20 seconds.
Definitely not a 'waste of slots'.
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2011-05-13 10:40
EDIT: Doesn't really matter. Siphon has a much bigger energy issue than EAD, and is not the best choice when facing them. ELF is still not worth it over aux gens but hey.
[ This Message was edited by: General Zod on 2011-05-13 12:26 ]
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Zero28
Grand Admiral
Joined: August 25, 2006
Posts: 591
| Posted: 2011-05-13 12:01
i tought Kluth was hit n run, not Stick around in a fight. If you get alphaed to hull, your doing something wrong, try hitting the rear instead 
BUt i am for the Buff Of the Sheilds strengh, Ok THey do have rotation, But its actually sad to see 2 ARcs worth of sheild die in a second
[ This Message was edited by: Zero28 on 2011-05-13 12:02 ]
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MrSparkle
Marshal
Joined: August 13, 2001
Posts: 1912
From: mrsparkle
| Posted: 2011-05-13 12:11
In this version, depending on the ship you're facing, as Kluth you get hulled in 1 alpha.
That's not a bad thing. Kluth do more damage in return.
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Ravendark
Marshal
Sanity Assassins
Joined: July 01, 2010
Posts: 443
| Posted: 2011-05-13 13:50
i have to support kennys issue. ELF are really turnin out to be waste of time and space. increase a drain a bit or fire of rate. a bit at least...
one more thing...can someone tell me the point of 1 ecm on siphon?
[ This Message was edited by: Ravendark on 2011-05-13 13:52 ]
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